Who Owns A Sonore Signature Rendu?

[wisnon]

Anything that locks in place I like: XLR, RJ45, Neutrik, BNC. Which does not leave much room for LVDS.

 

MSB has one with RJ45 but I do not think it is LVDS compatible.

 

Agree on HDMI, having had quite a few break even under its own cable weight, or just suddenly stop working.

Dont mix up the data protocol with the cable physics. LVDS does not have to be by HDMI cable...

[tranz]

Dont mix up the data protocol with the cable physics. LVDS does not have to be by HDMI cable...

 

Of course, but you need more physical wires for I2S than are available on XLR, neutrik, and BNC. The Pro world also uses DB25 which locks and could be a good off the shelf option as well. Never had issues with the HEAVY cable using DB25.

[wisnon]

Understood, but HDMI cables are easy to get (cheap enuff) and near universal, so unless there is a compelling reason NOT to use them, why not? Plus a few brands already use them.

[vortecjr]

Thanks for the input Jesus.

 

So I guess it is helpful because not all LVDS pin outs are the same due to the lack of standard.

 

In the case of the PS Audio and SRS, does the DAC's clock get sent and used via LVDS, and could something like that be changed via software/firmware?

 

Could you please clarify the comment on the MSB RJ45 and counting it indefinitely, I do not understand.

 

Great to hear about the receiver boards!

 

There is a group of us coordinating behind the scenes to make sure we are all compatible. The specification (modified PS Audio) is very simple to add compared to USB so don't let the manufacturers give you excuses:) The RJ45 i2s output in general is standard unbalanced i2s and not compatible. The SSR sends the master clock all the time and I'm not sure if the DS ignores it completely or if it uses it to figure out the new clock. Some of the devices (such as my DAC and the K&K audio DAC) use the master clock signal if they run in synchronous mode. In regards to MSB's Pro i2s Network I meant counting it "out" indefinitely because they are not open to sharing the specification with us to interface with.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

One thing that AudioByte can do that I haven't seen from the other I2s vendors is that they can switch polarity on the LVDS.

 

The SSR can do this and can also switch the output signal rate. However, I prefer people not open the units and leave the settings as shipped.

 

Jesus R

[vortecjr]

Team, I use to keep a database on i2s and the format / connectors used are all over the place. HDMI LVDS i2s is really a nice solution and changing it will not improve things or help move the cause along...

 

Jesus R

[tranz]

There is a group of us coordinating behind the scenes to make sure we are all compatible. The specification (modified PS Audio) is very simple to add compared to USB so don't let the manufacturers give you excuses:) The RJ45 i2s output in general is standard unbalanced i2s and not compatible. The SSR sends the master clock all the time and I'm not sure if the DS ignores it completely or if it uses it to figure out the new clock. Some of the devices (such as my DAC and the K&K audio DAC) use the master clock signal if they run in synchronous mode. In regards to MSB's Pro i2s Network I meant counting it "out" indefinitely because they are not open to sharing the specification with us to interface with.

 

Jesus R

 

Thanks Jesus.

[Superdad]

Team, I use to keep a database on i2s and the format / connectors used are all over the place. HDMI LVDS i2s is really a nice solution and changing it will not improve things or help move the cause along...

 

Jesus R

 

Plus, in addition to LVDS being a robust way to handle I2S (not that I would want to go really long distances still), HDMI cables themselves--even if the connector is not a dream--are designed for very wide bandwidth and even cheap ones are more suited to the task than some random twisted-pair CAT cable.

[One and a half]

You are entitled to your opinion, but I think you are being overly critical. I'm not having any issues with my HDMI cable (I use the Blue Jean cable that comes with the SSR) and I'm not having any issues with the HDMI connector. Most importantly, I have included the HDMI LVDS i2s output on several products and I'm not receiving any complaints from customers. I'm just saying...

 

Jesus R

 

Our opinions are parallel, no further discussions are required then, no problem.

[One and a half]

Does Ravenna deal with packetized data crud?

 

Packetised crud is the problem of the hardware in the receiver, not the protocol, which delivers the packets on time.

 

In looking at LVDS, is that packetised, it is serial data consisting of words? Is this a never ending circle?

[vortecjr]

Ravenna would still require converting the data (regardless of how we get it) to i2s and SPDIF. The Rendu controls the data transfer asynchronous and then buffers the data for playback. The Rendu is an elegant solution so no need to worrying about the nuisances....just enjoy the music.

 

Jesus R

[kilroy]

Has anyone heard both the Signature and base editions (with or without the I2S option) and is able to comment on the sonic differences?

[tranz]

... Getting S/PDIF to be really good is actually much harder than delivering a good LVDS I2S. There is much more "art" in the former than in the latter. Someone should put the SSR up against the Bekeley Alpha USB if you want to hear just how good a job John did with this piece.

 

This I would love to know too, a comparison shootout between:

 

1. Aries with Berkeley Alpha USB-SPDIF converter

2. SRS via SPDIF

 

On a side note, is there any plan to make the SRS OpenHome compliant? Is this possible through a firmware update?

 

Cheers

[ted_b]

This I would love to know too, a comparison shootout between:

 

1. Aries with Berkeley Alpha USB-SPDIF converter

2. SRS via SPDIF

 

On a side note, is there any plan to make the SRS OpenHome compliant? Is this possible through a firmware update?

 

Cheers

 

 

The Sonore Signature Rendu (aka SSR; not SRS ) is easily made OpenHome compliant, and I have commented on it numerous times here. I'll do it again:

You simply run BubbleUPnP Server on the NAS (with Minimserver). Bubble Server is not another music server, it is a UPnP service extender, for things like better security, more networking...and creating OpenHome renderers. Bubble's home URL then prompts you to copy your UPnP renderer on the LAN into an OH one, and rename it. So on OH compatible control points (Kazoo, Lumin, Lightning, as well as others that do both) my renderer shows up as "Signature Rendu" (my rename) in addition to the regular UPnP Audio-renderer-153 or whatever. All OH advantages are then available (more robust cp's, playlisty owned by renderer, not local control point, etc).

[tranz]

The Sonore Signature Rendu (aka SSR; not SRS ) is easily made OpenHome compliant, and I have commented on it numerous times here. I'll do it again:

You simply run BubbleUPnP Server on the NAS (with Minimserver). Bubble Server is not another music server, it is a UPnP service extender, for things like better security, more networking...and creating OpenHome renderers. Bubble's home URL then prompts you to copy your UPnP renderer on the LAN into an OH one, and rename it. So on OH compatible control points (Kazoo, Lumin, Lightning, as well as others that do both) my renderer shows up as "Signature Rendu" (my rename) in addition to the regular UPnP Audio-renderer-153 or whatever. All OH advantages are then available (more robust cp's, playlisty owned by renderer, not local control point, etc).

 

Hi Ted,

 

Yes, we chatted about the BubbleUPnp server before.

 

I meant natively like the Aries.

[ted_b]

What is native OpenHome? It's all software extensions, either done in the renderer (like Aries) or done in the network, like Bubble Server. I'd be interested in knowing the advantages of doing it in the renderer (one could argue the renderer should do little) but maybe these extensions make for better integrity nearer the DAC...dunno. I'm learning something new in DLNA land everyday....and getting tired of it. (just kidding).

[Cebolla]

Ted,

 

I believe OpenHome Media is an extension to the standard UPnP specification (not software), so it can't be assumed that ohMedia software interfaces are compatible with standard UPnP ones. The BubbleUPnP Server behaves as a translator between the two systems. So the main advantage is that if you have a renderer that natively supports ohMedia, you are making more efficient uses of your resources, both with the network itself and the device you'd otherwise run the BubbleUPnP Server on.

 

John

[ted_b]

John, Sounds good but what does it mean...more efficient uses of these resources? And what is a UPnP spec extension if not code (ie software)? I don't mean to be argumentative (at least not this time ) I am really trying to understand if Bubble Server is, at any stretch, "in the way". I asked Simon and he said a definitive no..but that's one perspective. Thx

Ted

P.S. At least the way Bubble has implemented this OH 'virtual thing' I have yet to find a control point that doesn't see my Rendu's OH version. The converse is not true (my standard UPnP Rendu is only seen by non-OH control points).

[vortecjr]

This I would love to know too, a comparison shootout between:

 

1. Aries with Berkeley Alpha USB-SPDIF converter

2. SRS via SPDIF

I would not under estimate the Rendu's SPDIF output:)

 

On a side note, is there any plan to make the SRS OpenHome compliant? Is this possible through a firmware update?

The unit is optimized to work with JRiver and adding this would break that compatibility. Anything is possible though.

 

Jesus R

[rodrigaj]

I would not under estimate the Rendu's SPDIF output:)

 

 

The unit is optimized to work with JRiver and adding this would break that compatibility. Anything is possible though.

 

Jesus R

 

Jesus-

Are you suggesting that we install JRiver linux on a NAS or were you referring to a Rendu>Caps>DAC setup where JRiver would reside on the CAPS? I'm not sure what you meant by "optimized to work with JRiver".

[vortecjr]

Jesus-

Are you suggesting that we install JRiver linux on a NAS or were you referring to a Rendu>Caps>DAC setup where JRiver would reside on the CAPS? I'm not sure what you meant by "optimized to work with JRiver".

 

No, I'm referring to people who run JRiver on a computer. What I meant is that a lot of work went into making sure it works with JRiver because 50% of my customers use it.

 

Jesus R

[tranz]

I would not under estimate the Rendu's SPDIF output:)

 

 

The unit is optimized to work with JRiver and adding this would break that compatibility. Anything is possible though.

 

Jesus R

 

Thanks for the input Jesus.

 

I am sure the SPDIF is very well done.

 

But wait, JRiver is dictating your hardware design? That is disappointing. Why would anyone even use JRiver with the Rendu?

 

One of the great things about the Rendu is being able to get rid of bloatware, Macs and PCs. Minimserver on a NAS (or even a computer if one must), and a controller like Lightning DS, Linn or AudioNet. Done!

 

Auralic has an option to switch between OHMedia and UPnP in its controller. Perhaps that is a good option, but only if it does not degrade sound. A few of us have tried Bubble UPnP server to emulate OHMedia, which might be the way to go. However, it is for the computer savvy, and even then much can go wrong. From a consumer functionality and ease of use perspective, OHmedia is the best. But of course audio quality comes first.

 

Cheers

[vortecjr]

Thanks for the input Jesus.

 

I am sure the SPDIF is very well done.

 

But wait, JRiver is dictating your hardware design? That is disappointing. Why would anyone even use JRiver with the Rendu?

 

One of the great things about the Rendu is being able to get rid of bloatware, Macs and PCs. Minimserver on a NAS (or even a computer if one must), and a controller like Lightning DS, Linn or AudioNet. Done!

 

Auralic has an option to switch between OHMedia and UPnP in its controller. Perhaps that is a good option, but only if it does not degrade sound. A few of us have tried Bubble UPnP server to emulate OHMedia, which might be the way to go. However, it is for the computer savvy, and even then much can go wrong. From a consumer functionality and ease of use perspective, OHmedia is the best. But of course audio quality comes first.

 

Cheers

 

Because JRiver is an excellent DLNA server/controller.

 

Jesus R

[firedog]

Because lots of us prefer JRiver and JRemote to any other UI we've encountered.

[tranz]

Fair enough, understood.