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I'm missing something basic..


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When I Airplay to the Apple TV, what leaves the computer must be analog.

If I Airplay to a wifi dac, aren't I still sending analog?

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Don’t fully understand what you are doing, but you are never sending anything analog over Airplay.

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Don’t fully understand what you are doing, but you are never sending anything analog over Airplay.

 

First, thank you for responding.

 

So, if I'm sending information to Airplay that is digitalized by the DAC in my PowerBook, then the wifi DAC that Airplay is sending the information to is re-converting what the dac in the laptop sent?

 

Like I said, I'm probably missing something easy or ??? I'm not sure.

 

What I'm trying to do is to increase the quality of the sound in my upstairs system which 1) now uses Mac to Audirvana to Airplay to pre-amp by 2) going to Mac to Audirvana to Airplay to a wifi DAC to pre-amp.

 

So, likely in some mistaken way it seems that if 1) uses the Mac's DAC, so will 2) and the information will be processed twice.

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Hi thotdoc

Still do not follow you... I think you need to describe how the upstairs system and how that is connected to your MBP.

Roon client on iPad/MacBookPro

Roon Server & HQPlayer on Mac Mini 2.0 GHz i7 with JS-2

LPS-1 & ultraRendu → Lampizator Atlantic → Bent Audio TAP-X → Atma-sphere M60 → Zero autoformers → Harbeth Compact 7 ES-3

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First, thank you for responding.

 

So, if I'm sending information to Airplay that is digitalized by the DAC in my PowerBook, then the wifi DAC that Airplay is sending the information to is re-converting what the dac in the laptop sent?

 

Like I said, I'm probably missing something easy or ??? I'm not sure.

 

What I'm trying to do is to increase the quality of the sound in my upstairs system which 1) now uses Mac to Audirvana to Airplay to pre-amp by 2) going to Mac to Audirvana to Airplay to a wifi DAC to pre-amp.

 

So, likely in some mistaken way it seems that if 1) uses the Mac's DAC, so will 2) and the information will be processed twice.

 

1) is incorrect. Data transmitted via AirPlay is digital. My understanding is it will be converted to Apple Lossless at 16/44 for transmission, but conversion to analog only happens at the other end (i.e., in the DAC of the AppleTV).

John Walker - IT Executive

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That's what I was missing. Thank you. I didn't know there was a DAC in the Apple TV

 

Gordon

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Since the AppleTV has no analoge output i doubt that...

Roon client on iPad/MacBookPro

Roon Server & HQPlayer on Mac Mini 2.0 GHz i7 with JS-2

LPS-1 & ultraRendu → Lampizator Atlantic → Bent Audio TAP-X → Atma-sphere M60 → Zero autoformers → Harbeth Compact 7 ES-3

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Since the AppleTV has no analoge output i doubt that...

 

You're right, of course - whatever device is *downstream* of the AppleTV (fed by the HDMI or optical output from the AppleTV) has the DAC.

John Walker - IT Executive

Headphone - MacMini running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable Ethernet > mRendu Roon endpoint > Topping D90 > Topping A90 > Dan Clark Aeon 2 Closed / Focal Elegia

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OK then I'm not getting it or not explaining myself well enough.

 

Right now I'm listening to the upstairs system: Retina MBP>iTunes/A+>Air Play-Apple TV hdmi>preamp.

This system must rely on the dac in the MBP.

 

My question is?: When I go MBP>iTunes/A+>Air Play-Apple TV>hmdi or optical>DAC>preamp...What is the DAC processing? The analog from the MBP's dac?

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Ok, now I understand.

Everything is digital until it gets to the preamp where the only dac in the chain is located. The dac in the MBP is not involved in any way.

 

Your question: the dac in the preamp is processing the digital signal send from the AppleTV. The input to the AppleTV is a digital signal via Airplay (over wifi?) from your MBP.

 

How to improve? Try setting upsampling to 24/48 in A+ (even for hires). The issue is that the AppleTV only outputs 24/48 regardless of what it receives. It will up- or down-convert the incoming signal to match.

Roon client on iPad/MacBookPro

Roon Server & HQPlayer on Mac Mini 2.0 GHz i7 with JS-2

LPS-1 & ultraRendu → Lampizator Atlantic → Bent Audio TAP-X → Atma-sphere M60 → Zero autoformers → Harbeth Compact 7 ES-3

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Thank you. I'm so used to audio equipment pre-amps, I didn't realize there was an dac in the pre-amp for the audio only. Like I said when I started this, I was missing something basic.

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Thank you. I'm so used to audio equipment pre-amps, I didn't realize there was an dac in the pre-amp for the audio only. Like I said when I started this, I was missing something basic.

 

I'm afraid you still do, but I don't think it is your fault.

 

My question is?: When I go MBP>iTunes/A+>Air Play-Apple TV>hmdi or optical>DAC>preamp...What is the DAC processing? The analog from the MBP's dac?

 

I highlighted your DAC, but you wrote that. So where is your DAC ? well, there.

Seems daft, I know ...

 

Anyway, what is the DAC processing ? 24/48. So it takes 24/48 for input (which is output by the AppleTV).

If you let A+ resample from whatever the native source is to 24/48 then the AppleTV is not doing any conversions. A+ is now doing it instead, and assumed that that will be for the better ...

 

Your DAC is doing the conversion from digital 24/48 to analogue and your preamp just takes that analogue signal.

Unless it is a digital preamp from start to end, but you would know that (must have digital inputs).

 

 

Sorry for interfering, but I saw this conversation and thought ...

prrrt

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Anyway, what is the DAC processing ? 24/48. So it takes 24/48 for input (which is output by the AppleTV).

If you let A+ resample from whatever the native source is to 24/48 then the AppleTV is not doing any conversions. A+ is now doing it instead, and assumed that that will be for the better ...

 

Your DAC is doing the conversion from digital 24/48 to analogue and your preamp just takes that analogue signal.

Unless it is a digital preamp from start to end, but you would know that (must have digital inputs).

Two issues here.

 

Firstly, I believe Apple TVs output at 16/48, not 24/48 (though the original oversight was mentioned earlier in the thread).

 

Secondly, it's slightly more complicated by AirPlay actually streaming ALAC file format fixed at 16/44.1, so potentially another layer of conversion. So possibly, the 'ideal' would be to get A+ to output at 16/44.1 instead, as neither the AirPlay nor the Apple TV function to resample can be avoided.

 

Of course, it's entirely possible that no noticeable differences can be heard with whatever method is used!

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Firstly, I believe Apple TVs output at 16/48, not 24/48 (though the original oversight was mentioned earlier in the thread).

 

And to that regard I sure copied that (then wrong) data. Sorry !

Lush^3-e      Lush^2      Blaxius^2      Ethernet^2     HDMI^2     XLR^2

XXHighEnd (developer)

Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer)

Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer)

Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier)

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This has been a learning experience.

 

I had no idea the ATV was rendering the signal. I get it to have A+ do that and let the ATV pass it along.

 

Then, what I've been calling a pre-amp (many years of habit) is actually an HT processor, so the Dac in that is the 'dac'.

 

So, in using an outboard DAC I'd use the 'ht bypass' I'd imagine.

 

I'm now thinking of getting a better HT pre-processor with better internal DAC than using an outboard dac...but then upgrading is harder.

 

Under any circumstances I appreciate everyone's input

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