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Poll: should JRiver remove the JPlay is a hoax warnings from their JRMC product?


Antoine

Should JRiver remove the JPlay is a hoax warnings from their JRMC product?  

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The question of this poll is an easy one: should JRiver remove the "JPlay is a hoax" warnings from their JRiver Media Center (JRMC) product?

 

These warnings pop up intermittently at the start of music playback when JRMC detects JPlay is running on the same machine as JRMC.

 

Thank you for your (anonymous) vote!

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J.River should make their own decision. If you don't like it; don't use their software!

 

I'm sorry this discussion has been done to death elsewhere.

Eloise

---

...in my opinion / experience...

While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing.

And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism.

keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out.

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Glad to see that you have finally taken this discussion to a separate thread.

 

Yes, I apologize to Ted_B, I should have done that from the start.

 

Antoine, why don't you write your own software instead of demanding that JRiver obey your orders?

 

I am not a software developer.

 

J.River should make their own decision. If you don't like it; don't use their software!

 

I'm sorry this discussion has been done to death elsewhere.

 

And I am sorry I missed those discussions, I haven't been around since day one.

 

I did like their software, but not so much anymore because of the popups but I didn't know about these popups when I bought the software. I only started using JPlay recently.

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With these popup they primarily "punish" their own customers instead of the company they blame. I'd prefer JRiver to take legal actions, fight it out in court; let a judge decide if what JPlay is doing is in any way "parasitic hijacking".

 

In its basis I don't see a difference between JPlay and software like Audirvana (especially in it's earlier versions that didn't have a media player).

 

The 'J' of JPlay could be the J of Josef, the primary writer/developer of JPlay. No one can really prove if that J is used to hitchhike on JRiver's 'succes'. JPlay can function with any program/music player that can send it's output to an ASIO device (virtual or not).

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I found this post from alcarp a strong one:

 

I've got no vested interested in this as I don't have either JRiver or Jplay.

 

But lets recap the issues:

 

The authors of JRiver feel strongly about JPlay. Fair enough. They have a web presence and a very active forum. They can use either or both to communicate their views to customers and potential customers. There is no need to force an intruding banner about JPlay being fake on an unsuspecting customer.

 

I think its disingenuous for someone to say you have freedom of choice and can stop using JRiver because by that time the customer has already paid for the licence. Is JRiver willing to refund the entry price?

 

Regarding the naming of JPlay someone advanced the hypothesis that if an author created a product called iPlay as an add-on to iTunes it would incur Apple's displeasure. In that case, Apple can sue for infringement of brand identity. JRiver is free to do the same.

 

Lastly, to claim that another product is a fake so brazenly is to allege conduct bordering on the criminal. At the very least, if JRiver is justified in making such a claim they should at least get an independent authority to verify this claim by a properly conducted double blind test. JRiver should either put up or shut up.

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At the end of the day a "poll" here is not going to change anyone at Jriver's mind...

Eloise

---

...in my opinion / experience...

While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing.

And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism.

keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out.

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I can understand why J River would believe that a warning is appropriate. However, a more informative and less aggressive warning - e.g. a disclaimer that JPlay may cause compatibility problems and/or, that J River's position is that it offers no sonic benefits - would be more effective.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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I can understand why J River would believe that a warning is appropriate. However, a more informative and less aggressive warning - e.g. a disclaimer that JPlay may cause compatibility problems and/or, that J River's position is that it offers no sonic benefits - would be more effective.

 

Yes, and they could also display the "warning" just once. Currently they repeat the warning every now and then. I can't see any justification for that and I can't think of any other reason for JRiver to do that but to annoy and irritate their customers.

 

Additional problem for me was that I have no browser installed on my 2012R2 machine and thus JRiver gives an error message that I needed to acknowledge first, otherwise music playback wouldn't start. Since it is a headless machine I had to connect a keyboard and press enter once before I could just sit down, relax and listen to some music.

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I support JRiver and their necessity to make their own business decisions. Just as I would support your ability to make your own choice whether to use JRiver and/or JPlay or not.

 

A popup warning is certainly a lot fewer hoops to jump through and a lot less inconvenient than what many of us have had to jump through to convert their SACDs to DSD files. Lets say it is minor compared to something that would be real benefit to the audio community. Ripping SACDs? Yes. This? Not so much...

 

Life is hard, choices define us. Yet our ability to choose is what defines our freedom. Without our ability to choose for ourselves, we are not free. Imagine a world where people and companies were not allowed to make their own choices. The Twentieth Century has a few examples of how well that idea worked out.

 

The ability for each of you (JRiver and you) to make their own choices is far more important than your convenience to not have to deal with a pop up window.

Positive emotions enhance our musical experiences.

 

Synology DS213+ NAS -> Auralic Vega w/Linear Power Supply -> Auralic Vega DAC (Symposium Jr rollerball isolation) -> XLR -> Auralic Taurus Pre -> XLR -> Pass Labs XA-30.5 power amplifier (on 4" maple and 4 Stillpoints) -> Hawthorne Audio Reference K2 Speakers in MTM configuration (Symposium Jr HD rollerball isolation) and Hawthorne Audio Bass Augmentation Baffles (Symposium Jr rollerball isolation) -> Bi-amped w/ two Rythmic OB plate amps) -> Extensive Room Treatments (x2 SRL Acoustics Prime 37 diffusion plus key absorption and extensive bass trapping) and Pi Audio Uberbuss' for the front end and amplification

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I support JRiver and their necessity to make their own business decisions. Just as I would support your ability to make your own choice whether to use JRiver and/or JPlay or not.

 

A popup warning is certainly a lot fewer hoops to jump through and a lot less inconvenient than what many of us have had to jump through to convert their SACDs to DSD files. Lets say it is minor compared to something that would be real benefit to the audio community. Ripping SACDs? Yes. This? Not so much...

 

Life is hard, choices define us. Yet our ability to choose is what defines our freedom. Without our ability to choose for ourselves, we are not free. Imagine a world where people and companies were not allowed to make their own choices. The Twentieth Century has a few examples of how well that idea worked out.

 

The ability for each of you (JRiver and you) to make their own choices is far more important than your convenience to not have to deal with a pop up window.

 

+1, and let's not forget the formatting hassles we are all going through because Apple refuses to embrace FLAC.

Analog: Koetsu Rosewood > VPI Aries 3 w/SDS > EAR 834P > EAR 834L: Audiodesk cleaner

Digital Fun: DAS > CAPS v3 w/LPS (JRMC) SOtM USB > Lynx Hilo > EAR 834L

Digital Serious: DAS > CAPS v3 w/LPS (HQPlayer) Ethernet > SMS-100 NAA > Lampi DSD L4 G5 > EAR 834L

Digital Disc: Oppo BDP 95 > EAR 834L

Output: EAR 834L > Xilica XP4080 DSP > Odessey Stratos Mono Extreme > Legacy Aeris

Phones: EAR 834L > Little Dot Mk ii > Senheiser HD 800

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Yes, and they could also display the "warning" just once. Currently they repeat the warning every now and then. I can't see any justification for that and I can't think of any other reason for JRiver to do that but to annoy and irritate their customers.

 

Additional problem for me was that I have no browser installed on my 2012R2 machine and thus JRiver gives an error message that I needed to acknowledge first, otherwise music playback wouldn't start. Since it is a headless machine I had to connect a keyboard and press enter once before I could just sit down, relax and listen to some music.

 

You are using JRiver MC with JPlay which they don't support. You are using it on a server OS that JRiver doesn't support. And you complain over and over.

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If someone wrote parasitic hijacking software to run along with something I wrote, claiming it was superior, but without basis, and naming it in such a way that it implied a commercial endorsement, I would probably do a lot more than write a pop-up warning.

 

But since nobody actually did that maybe you should please eat a dog biscuit drink some water and then find a friendly fire hydrant...

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You are using JRiver MC with JPlay which they don't support. You are using it on a server OS that JRiver doesn't support. And you complain over and over.

 

That's very interesting. Can you point to where JRiver state that they don't support their software on Windows Server 2012? Because I would certainly consider that a reason not to buy a license.

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Looking further into this Jariver is priced at less than $50 US for a license - this for a product that has an excellent comprehensive data base manager as well as a very good playback engine.

 

Japlay, OTOH, is just a player and a device driver and is priced at a whopping 100 euro.

 

This seems to me to be a rip-off. Perhaps the authors of JPlay can justify this pricing?

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I support JRiver and their necessity to make their own business decisions. Just as I would support your ability to make your own choice whether to use JRiver and/or JPlay or not.

 

A popup warning is certainly a lot fewer hoops to jump through and a lot less inconvenient than what many of us have had to jump through to convert their SACDs to DSD files. Lets say it is minor compared to something that would be real benefit to the audio community. Ripping SACDs? Yes. This? Not so much...

 

Life is hard, choices define us. Yet our ability to choose is what defines our freedom. Without our ability to choose for ourselves, we are not free. Imagine a world where people and companies were not allowed to make their own choices. The Twentieth Century has a few examples of how well that idea worked out.

 

The ability for each of you (JRiver and you) to make their own choices is far more important than your convenience to not have to deal with a pop up window.

 

Your surely have the strangest way of reasoning I have ever seen. How can you compare the "inconvenience" of missing SACD conversion functionality with this? JRiver deliberately put resources into creating this browser popup message that is shown when JPlay is detected (by routines JRiver wrote) running on the same system.

 

Again, we're not talking about a random error message as result of a bug causing a pop up or anything like that but a deliberately built in 'punishment' for any JPlay user that, don't forget, also happens to be a paying JRiver customer. How can you tie up something like this to 'choice' and 'freedom' and make it sound like a good thing? It's really backward and a pathetic way of JRiver to show their fight with JPlay. They should fight it out in court if they have the balls, but perhaps they know they don't stand a chance...

 

Really, I compare this to e.g. Microsoft building in functionality into Windows that detects and warns when the user of Windows installs or uses software of arch rival Apple. They should have better put these resources into developing your desired SACD conversion functionality or anything else useful that doesn't try to insult their own customers.

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