One and a half Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Tell you what, if these simpler network players keep coming, this one at YEN46,000 and they actually work gapless, and just about every format, including DSD128, the computer is getting more nails in the coffin. People want simple easy to use devices for playing music, computers are too complex. For this Denon, I would heave the RCA's and run XLR outs for the upper market model and engineer a USB OUT. This model works off iPad/Android for remote and Airplay. AS Profile Equipment List Say NO to MQA Link to comment
Cebolla Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Looks like Denon have at last come up with a replacement for its ancient DNP-720AE streamer. Let's hope it works as it's supposed to out of the box! We are far more united and have far more in common with each other than things that divide us. -- Jo Cox Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Looks like Denon have at last come up with a replacement for its ancient DNP-720AE streamer. Let's hope it works as it's supposed to out of the box! Presumably it will use the same streaming module as the Marantz do... Now if only they would work on their control apps and offer something more akin to Lumin / Lightning DS. Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
Cebolla Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Indeed. So sad that we still have to hope for this, rather than expect it! We are far more united and have far more in common with each other than things that divide us. -- Jo Cox Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Indeed. So sad that we still have to hope for this, rather than expect it! Like several control apps: the Marantz is so nearly there... Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
wappinghigh Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Nice find. Thanks for posting... New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra Link to comment
linvincible Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Presumably it will use the same streaming module as the Marantz do... Now if only they would work on their control apps and offer something more akin to Lumin / Lightning DS. not so sure since the Marantz could not get DSD from network, only USB input But if they upgraded that on the NA-11S1 it would make it a beast! Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 not so sure since the Marantz could not get DSD from network, only USB inputBut if they upgraded that on the NA-11S1 it would make it a beast! I think the new NA6005 and the NA8005 offer DSD via the network - these are newer than the NA-11S1. Also Marantz SR6009 and SR7009 AV receivers offer DSD via network. PS. not sure what the state of DSD128 / DSD 5.6MHz is via network on the Marantz streamers. PPS. I was speculating generally as I know Marantz and Denon share a lot of technology - just look at the backs of their respective AV receivers. Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
Isaacc7 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Once again, no pre outs. Sigh. Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Once again, no pre outs. Sigh. Well that's because Denon don't sell any (HiFi) power amps. Most of Denon's customers will be matching it with an integrated amplifier. So what's wrong with a good pre-amp? Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
Ned Kelly Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 I really need to start using my BDP-105D a whole lot more than I do currently - it does so many of the things that folk seem to be crying out for in a network player and it has digital outputs. I just have to get past my current obsession with upsampling everything to DSD128 - I'm afraid I dont share the generally high opinion of the SABRE DAC implementation in the Oppo held by many on CA. Also agree re the control point software - this has to be UPnP's Achilles heel for mine and massively frustrating. Just one more headphone and I know I can kick this nasty little habit ! Link to comment
wappinghigh Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 ^ The huge problem with the Oppo's is they don't do gapless. Or at least didn't last I tried a few months back... UPnP DSD steaming is also a no go. Just via smb. New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra Link to comment
One and a half Posted November 6, 2014 Author Share Posted November 6, 2014 Yamaha does gapless for WAV and FLAC for a while now, so gapless is not that hard. I guess Yamaha will release a DSD network device, their top SACD players feature DSD on the USB input. Gapless on the Oppo is no excuse. AS Profile Equipment List Say NO to MQA Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Oh ... another appeal to streamer manufacturers ... be clear about what formats your device supports ... There's not point saying (for example) your streamer supports DSD 5.6MHz ... but not be clear that it only works via USB. Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
realhifi Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Once again, no pre outs. Sigh. Not many sources I know of that have pre outs. Or volume control for that matter. David Link to comment
Isaacc7 Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Well that's because Denon don't sell any (HiFi) power amps. Most of Denon's customers will be matching it with an integrated amplifier. So what's wrong with a good pre-amp? It's one more thing to buy. I've got active speakers and it's great to be able to run directly to the speakers without another box. I'm using a Pioneer receiver right now and have no complaints really but it would be great to have a nice one box solution. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment
Isaacc7 Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Not many sources I know of that have pre outs. Or volume control for that matter. It would be trivial to add a preamp section to it. Nicer to have fewer boxes IMO. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 It's one more thing to buy. I've got active speakers and it's great to be able to run directly to the speakers without another box. I'm using a Pioneer receiver right now and have no complaints really but it would be great to have a nice one box solution. It would be trivial to add a preamp section to it. Nicer to have fewer boxes IMO. Well I'm not sure it would be trivial... Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
Isaacc7 Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Well I'm not sure it would be trivial... I'm pretty sure it would be actually. They could certainly use their existing circuitry from their receiver line. The engineering has already been done and I think the sonics from the current generations of receivers is quite good, especially at the price. The only question is how much it would add to the price. Doubt it would be all that much. Link to comment
unsleepable Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 I'm pretty sure it would be actually. They could certainly use their existing circuitry from their receiver line. The engineering has already been done and I think the sonics from the current generations of receivers is quite good, especially at the price. The only question is how much it would add to the price. Doubt it would be all that much. I agree with Audio_ELF—adding a pot to change the volume is one thing, but making a decent preamp seems to be a task of a different magnitude. I've been in the market for a digital preamp for a few months now, and have sadly seen many examples of this. Link to comment
Isaacc7 Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 I agree with Audio_ELF—adding a pot to change the volume is one thing, but making a decent preamp seems to be a task of a different magnitude. I've been in the market for a digital preamp for a few months now, and have sadly seen many examples of this. But that's my point, they already make a decent preamp as part of their other products. A receiver without the power amps is all I'm asking for. That is surely well within their capabilities and can use previous work. No reason to reinvent the wheel. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment
wappinghigh Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Aren't we being a bit picky on the Denon here..? my goolge translate says it has both digital and analog pre outs... whilst I can't seem to find a picture of the back of the thing (to be sure). ... Also having the added amps inbuilt is just a bonus.. you could set up a second zone... My issue would be (as Eloise says) does it network *stream* DSD as well as play it for a USB..? New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra Link to comment
wappinghigh Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 But that's my point, they already make a decent preamp as part of their other products. A receiver without the power amps is all I'm asking for. That is surely well within their capabilities and can use previous work. No reason to reinvent the wheel. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Wait. I found a pic of the back. hahaha I'm wrong. There are no amps! This "is a receiver" without power amps!!! Is this not JUST WHAT YOU WANT! LOL! New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra Link to comment
wappinghigh Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Dedicated Music Streamers hifi product launches from brands such as Linn, Naim and Musical Fidelity | HifiEnthusiast.co.uk nice up to date comparisons New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra Link to comment
rodrigaj Posted November 8, 2014 Share Posted November 8, 2014 Dedicated Music Streamers hifi product launches from brands such as Linn, Naim and Musical Fidelity | HifiEnthusiast.co.uk nice up to date comparisons Thank you for that link. "The function of music is to release us from the tyranny of conscious thought", Sir Thomas Beecham. Link to comment
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