NAD C390DD Users?

[lg.lindstrom]

Many thanks for the heads up.

 

Your friend might find this link helpful: I discovered it a few minutes ago while continuing to try to fins a critical mass of C390 users to talk with.

 

 

 

 

He is aware about that link. Unfortunately it did not work for him.

Just to be clear. He is extremely satisfied with C390 despite this. The shop will compensate him with a external Blue Sound and he thinks C390 sounds terrific.

[Audio_ELF]

I don't think I'm bi-polar ...

I'm not bi-polar, but that woman in the mirror says I am :-)

 

(I hope no one takes offence at that attempt at humour)

[tpointon]

Regarding item 4 in my original post, I have discovered (with prompting from a reader on another forum) that Optical In's are replicated on Coax Out's and vice versa. But digital content from other inputs (USB, HDMI module, Computer USB) are not. I suspect that the signal from the DD-BluOS module will not be made available there either.

[tpointon]

I'm not bi-polar, but that woman in the mirror says I am :-)

 

(I hope no one takes offence at that attempt at humour)

Audio_ELF, you and I must share a similar sense of humour, and corresponding aversion to causing offence ... I had the same pang before I clicked "post". But we both clicked, so what must that say? Hmmmm..

[tpointon]

This is an invitation to other owners to experiment and report your findings. I'm confused by the unit's behaviour and wish to know if the conclusions I am coming to are shared.

 

I've been experimenting with the settings for Pre-Out / Sub. As you are no doubt aware, the C390DD has a single pair of RCA jacks on the rear that serve dual purpose; they are collectively labelled PRE OUT/SUBW and individually SUBW 1 and SUBW 2.

 

In the Setup menus, there is a corresponding item; actually a pair of items. One enables/disables PRE OUT and the other enables/disables SUBW. The manual says, and my experiments confirm, that enabling one will automatically disable the other. That makes sense since they could not both be enabled given that they share the same port. Notice that this precludes running a sub and at the same time feeding a preamp output to another system. I'm unsure why the designers chose to impose this constraint. Was it to save on the cost of another pair of jacks?

 

When I fist discovered this, I thought "Why not just a toggle that offers PRE OUT or SUBW?" since it's one or the other but not both. But lately, it has occurred to me that a toggle would not allow for "neither". My experiments indicate that in fact you can disable both in which case there is no signal on the output jacks. So of the choices YES/YES, YES/NO, NO/YES and NO/NO, only YES/YES is disallowed.

 

Now to the Speakers Off / Headphones part. I recall a post elsewhere where a C390 owner lamented the absence of a headphone jack on the unit. Although I understood what he was getting at, I thought it unsurprising given the purely digital nature of the C390. Headphones are analogue devices. As I understand it, the C390 doesn't go analogue until the bitter end, just before output to the speakers, and even then it uses some kind of high frequency square wave smoothing to create a curvy (analogue, sinusoidal) wave.

 

NAD must have been listening, because in a recent software/manual upgrade they added a feature to the function of the remote control. Holding down the Mute button for a second or two turns the speakers off. The display momentarily reads Speakers Off but then reads Headphones On. Now momentary pressings of the mute button toggles between Headphones Off and Headphones On. Long-pressing Mute turns the speakers back on.

 

Since I am listening to headphones via a headphone amp connected to one of the digital outs, I really don't think of turning off the speakers as turning on the phones. I am only interested in quieting the speakers. I normally run a sub on the rear jacks, but when I long-press the Mute button to turn speakers off, I find I still have a signal at the sub.

 

Now, I consider a sub to be a speaker, but perhaps NAD does not. So I think to myself, "Okay, let's disable both PRE OUT and SUB and then turn speakers off. I have verified that when I disable both, they seem to be stuck on disabled throughout entries/exits to the menu and there is nothing coming from the sub.

 

So, now I long-press Mute and what do you think happens? If you thought "The room goes quiet" Im sorry to say "Wrong Guess". Nope, a signal shows up at the sub and it starts moaning away in the low end. A visit back to the menus confirms that although Subwoofer remains disabled, Pre Out has been enabled! I notice that although I have my sub crossing over at 40 hz, my sub is playing higher frequencies. I think the poor thing is getting everything up to 20 Khz but it just cannot cope. When I long-press Mute to turn the speakers back on, my sound is muddy on the bottom end and I must go into the menus to enable Sub (and thus disable pre-out, which started out disabled).

 

Now I have an Aha moment. In a recent conversation with NAD through their online support page, I asked how does one use headphones with the C390. Their answer was to plug my phones into the PRE OUT / SUBWOOFER jacks at the back of the amp. I told them

1. I already have a subwoofer plugged into those jacks.
   
2. I don't want to dig around behind the amp to connect phones.
   
3. 
   

I would add that

3. Headphones don't naturally plug into a pair of RCA jacks.

 

So here is the conclusion to which I am coming: The PRE OUT / SUBW jacks at the back of the unit and their matching menu entries for Pre-Out / Subwoofer are really nothing more than a pair of jacks that can either be enabled or disabled. If enabled, the signal presented there will either be LFE or the whole spectrum depending on which of Subwoofer or Pre-Out respectively is currently enabled.

 

My confusion comes from my former understanding that:

1. There is a difference between a pre-amplifier output and a headphone output.
   
2. Subwoofers are speakers.
   
3. Headphones don't normally come with a pair of RCA plugs on the non-listening end.
   
4. 
   

 

If you have the time, please experiment with this and then come back to answer:

1. Does this match your experience?
   
2. Do you think I am being overly critical in concluding that this is less than stellar design on the part of NAD?
   
3. 
   

[fc-racer]

Well, there you have it folks. I think NAD is a purveyor of quality analog gear struggling a bit with the end-user implications of digital. If I were to advise them, I would say "give the C390DD to your stable mate Bluesound; they'll probably know more about how to deal with it".

 

I hope this draws some feedback ... it took a while to get it all out. Does anybody else feel the same way about the C390?

 

I think your comment about NAD is unfair. I have not had the same experience as you with my 390DD. Indeed, I've been exceptionally happy with its performance and its ability to stay current with add-in modules. Here is a company that created this innovative implementation of technology to bring an exceptional signal-to-noise ratio and the ability to play music with essentially no audible distortion.

 

The 390DD is my fourth NAD amplifier and all three previous ones are still fully functional and continue to provide great sound. I haven't had any warranty issues or service issues with the NAD amplifiers over the last 20 years.

 

In regards to your points:

 

1. Nice to have but the updates are not mission critical and the forum users are good at notifying each other of updates. That's how I heard about the 2.88 update.

 

2. Agree with you on this. They need a better implementation. The BluOS module also has the same issue.

 

3. When you bought the amp, it was clear this feature was not there. Suggest you pick up an NAD 3020 or a good headphone amp from Oppo.

 

4. Don't use the output so cannot comment.

 

5. The BluOS is the same price as the Ruby DAC on my Creek 100A, so I think it's in-line and reasonable. Now that I've had the module for a few months, I almost exclusively use BluOS. It expands the amplifier capabilities significantly and allows music from a multitude of sources. NAD has also said they'll add MQA capability for free in the near future.

 

6. Technology moves on and things get upgraded. I highly doubt a human can tell the difference between 192 and 96. Get the BluOS module and you won't care about USB anymore.

 

7. Agree that I'd like more bands, but it's still a very useful feature. My Creek does not have anything and the room modes are out of control. The NAD sounds much better in that room because I can tame 90% of the modes.

 

I apologize if the above comes across as harsh, but I felt your comment about NAD was a bit harsh. I've had great experiences with their support when I've had questions and I've been very happy with the 390DD. Indeed, I'm planning to buy the new M32 because the only thing I don't like about the 390DD is the budget materials of the packaging.

[tpointon]

Rather than repeat the entire post, I will edit the quote showing (...) where content was deleted.

 

I think your comment about NAD is unfair. I have not had the same experience as you with my 390DD. Indeed, I've been exceptionally happy with its performance and its ability to stay current with add-in modules.(...)

 

In regards to your points:

 

1. Nice to have but the updates are not mission critical and the forum users are good at notifying each other of updates. That's how I heard about the 2.88 update.

 

2. Agree with you on this. They need a better implementation. The BluOS module also has the same issue.

 

3. When you bought the amp, it was clear this feature was not there. Suggest you pick up an NAD 3020 or a good headphone amp from Oppo.

 

4. Don't use the output so cannot comment.

 

5. The BluOS is the same price as the Ruby DAC on my Creek 100A, so I think it's in-line and reasonable. (...)

 

6. Technology moves on and things get upgraded. I highly doubt a human can tell the difference between 192 and 96. Get the BluOS module and you won't care about USB anymore.

 

7. Agree that I'd like more bands, but it's still a very useful feature. (...)

 

I apologize if the above comes across as harsh, but I felt your comment about NAD was a bit harsh.(...).

You're right that I was (or at least came across as) overly harsh. I appreciate your feedback and your candor.

 

My title for this post reflects my initial impressions after installing the BluOS module in my C390DD. What a difference that made!! I will elaborate in a separate post, but suffice to say that it has restored my belief that buying the NAD C390DD was the right decision for me.

 

Using the same point numbers.

 

1. I can live with periodic visits to the website checking for updates.

 

2. Check (auto-standby is sketchy)

 

3. I have a Fiio E17 headphone amp and a pair of AGK 550 phones. But at present, I have to keep my Raspberry Pi to bring digital content to the phones because I cannot bring what the C390DD has inside to the attention of the Fiio. This is even more frustrating now that I have the BluOS module since all digital content now arrives at the C390DD over ethernet. This inability to bring digital content out from the C390 remains a sticking point. It is (imho) the functional equivalent of the analog pre-out / main in jumpers that one has on higher end integrated amps.

 

4. This is my other sticking point. As long as I cannot use my headphone amp driven with signal from the C390DD, it is irrelevant since the amp will be off if I'm listening via phones. But if NAD ever addresses the digital out issue, they will also need to address this because turning speakers off must also mean turning off subwoofer output. I think it's doable, but they need to make the algorithm more sophisticated.

 

5. Yes. I think prospective buyers of the C390DD should consider the BluOS module as a near-necessity and factor that cost into the purchase decision.

 

6. I got the BluOS module and now I don't think I will ever select a different input unless I'm watching a DVD. (seldom in this room)

 

7. Room EQ is a huge topic that I'm only beginning to appreciate. I didn't have much success with NAD's manual procedure, but using Room Equalization Wizard to measure and calculate parameters has worked well. And I've learned a lot in the process.

 

I hope this is a more balanced presentation of my current position. I really do love the NAD C390DD. I've had it since early 2012 and now that it is for all intents and purposes a Bluesound Powernode on steroids, I think it will be the centrepiece of my audio system for years to come.

 

Tim

[tpointon]

Just after all this negativity about the C390DD I was going to comment if anyone in the UK is interested in the NAD C390DD Sevenoaks Audio (the UK importer / retailer) has a bunch of them at £999 which is half price. Anyway this led me to wonder if they are being discontinued or replaced?

If a prospective purchaser took some of the savings on a C390DD at half price and used it to add a DD-BluOS module, I think they would be very pleased with the result. Adding that module has made a world of difference for me. Even without the discount, the addition of the BluOS module to the C390DD sure makes for a clean, capable piece of equipment. No computer, no DAC, just Ethernet (Wi-Fi) straight into the box. Local files, streaming services, 192/24 (claimed, not yet tested). Control it from your iPad / tablet.

 

Tim P

[Audio_ELF]

@tpointon... Would it be right that your main sticking point (with headphones) is down to the fact that the NAD will support a subwoofer OR a headphone amp but not both?

[fc-racer]

You're right that I was (or at least came across as) overly harsh. I appreciate your feedback and your candor.

 

I hope this is a more balanced presentation of my current position. I really do love the NAD C390DD. I've had it since early 2012 and now that it is for all intents and purposes a Bluesound Powernode on steroids, I think it will be the centrepiece of my audio system for years to come.

 

Hi Tim,

 

I'm happy to hear the BluOS has made things better for you! I was confident it would make you happy as I find it to be a fantastic addition to the 390DD that really differentiates it from other amps.

 

I never tried the NAD method for the bass measurement as I also have REW and used that. REW is incredible and the developer deserves to become rich from creating that fantastic software. Before REW, I had no idea what my room was doing.

 

The only thing that continues to annoy me about this setup is the screen. I wish there was a way to auto-off the screen 15 seconds after the last user input. I find the scrolling file names distracting and annoying and it cheapens the appearance of the amp.

 

I've already sent in a feature request but we'll see if NAD is able to implement it in the future. Otherwise, this amplifier continues to amaze me with its clean sound, at low and high volume levels.

[trappy]

Do you have high-ish sensitivity speakers? My biggest beef with the 390DD was not so much it's lack of clarity at low levels, as its lack of oomph and general get up and go, but I did have 84db speakers. At higher levels it rocked, but I could only endure so much neighbor-hatred. There were also times I thought the supernatural clarity shaded into unnatural, but perhaps I'm being picky. Along with the Benchmark DAC2 it's one of the pieces that I really wished I could be happy with because what it did right was so good, and seemingly such good value.

[fc-racer]

Do you have high-ish sensitivity speakers? My biggest beef with the 390DD was not so much it's lack of clarity at low levels, as its lack of oomph and general get up and go, but I did have 84db speakers. At higher levels it rocked, but I could only endure so much neighbor-hatred. There were also times I thought the supernatural clarity shaded into unnatural, but perhaps I'm being picky. Along with the Benchmark DAC2 it's one of the pieces that I really wished I could be happy with because what it did right was so good, and seemingly such good value.

 

It's interesting you mention that because I felt the same way, so I did extensive testing using REW between the NAD and a highly regarded amplifier (Creek 100A) noted for its "punchiness" (whatever that means!).

 

What I found after several hours of testing were two things:

 

1. When matched to within 1db, there was no difference in punchiness or scale or dynamics between the amps. I doubt even a super human could tell any difference.

 

2. For some reason, I would naturally play the NAD at a lower volume level than the Creek. I put this down to the slow volume control on the NAD vs. the Creek.

 

I wrote a review of the amps on another forum so I won't repeat it here, but in the end, the NAD stayed in my main system and the Creek got relegated to the secondary system. Main reasons are I'm a sucker for no hiss on the NAD (love how music at high volumes rises from complete silence), and I feel the NAD has better control of the lower frequencies.

[trappy]

Interesting: I had a Creek Destiny for a short while; it actually annoyed me in more or less the same way that the 390DD did but with none of the NAD's compensating virtues. I was left wondering what people hear in the Creek amps. Pretty much the only one piece of equipment that I've definitely disliked.

[fc-racer]

Hi Trappy,

 

For me, I think the biggest draw of the Creek is that Mr. Mike Creek still owns the company It's nice to support a family business. The build quality and materials are also fantastic, really great packaging.

 

I'm us d to live in Toronto, but live in Asia now. Hope the winter ends soon for you!

[tpointon]

@tpointon... Would it be right that your main sticking point (with headphones) is down to the fact that the NAD will support a subwoofer OR a headphone amp but not both?

Sorry Audio_ELF for not replying. I thought I was in the loop via email, but I don't recall having notification of your post.

 

To your query, not exactly. My main points are:

 

1. Upon returning from the "Speakers off" function, the PRE-Out/Sub setting should be restored to the same state it was in before turning speakers off.

 

2. Whatever digital content is currently being processed should be made available at the two digital outs (1 optical, 1 coax) with the possible proviso that the internal resolution might exceed that possible for the given output. In that case (I cannot think of one at present), the amp would ideally downgrade the digital content to the highest resolution possible on that output.

 

The net result of these would be a workable way to alternate between headphone and speaker listening from the same source through the same common path up to the logical splitting point.

 

Hope this clarifies.

[tpointon]

I don't seem to be getting email notification of new posts to this thread. When I click on "Thread Tools" it offers "Unsubscribe from this thread" so I must be subscribed.

 

Any ideas?

[tpointon]

Hi Tim,

I never tried the NAD method for the bass measurement as I also have REW and used that. REW is incredible and the developer deserves to become rich from creating that fantastic software. Before REW, I had no idea what my room was doing.

By saying you never used the NAD method, I assume you mean the use of their 6 FLAC files and a SPL meter? But you must be manually entering REW's calculated settings into the NAD, right? btw, I had difficulty figuring out how to get REW to calculate filter values for the 6 fixed frequencies that are configurable on the NAD. I posted a question on the REW forum and shortly had an answer from the author, John, advising to click on "Calculate Gains and Qs" rather than the fully automatic calculation. You're right about John's massive effort in creating REW. The fact that it is freely available is beyond belief.

 

One of the things REW does is take into consideration overlapping filter settings. How well this works with the NAD is uncertain because all NAD gives for control of Q is a choice between "Wide" and "Narrow". So if REW says drop 120 hz by -2dB with a Q of 6.0 is that "Wide" or "Narrow"? I'm trying to get NAD to tell me what value of Q separates W from N.

 

I too find the scrolling annoying. The best one can do is play with the "Dim" button on the remote. On the flip side, it annoys me that when one enters the configuration menus, if you don't press something within a few seconds it kicks back out. One has to remember to press buttons for no reason to to give it a "keep alive" signal. They got the auto-off in the wrong place. :-)

 

btw, I am actively pursuing room issues on the Axiom forum (my speakers are Axiom M80 v2).

[fc-racer]

By saying you never used the NAD method, I assume you mean the use of their 6 FLAC files and a SPL meter? But you must be manually entering REW's calculated settings into the NAD, right? btw, I had difficulty figuring out how to get REW to calculate filter values for the 6 fixed frequencies that are configurable on the NAD. I posted a question on the REW forum and shortly had an answer from the author, John, advising to click on "Calculate Gains and Qs" rather than the fully automatic calculation. You're right about John's massive effort in creating REW. The fact that it is freely available is beyond belief.

 

One of the things REW does is take into consideration overlapping filter settings. How well this works with the NAD is uncertain because all NAD gives for control of Q is a choice between "Wide" and "Narrow". So if REW says drop 120 hz by -2dB with a Q of 6.0 is that "Wide" or "Narrow"? I'm trying to get NAD to tell me what value of Q separates W from N.

 

I too find the scrolling annoying. The best one can do is play with the "Dim" button on the remote. On the flip side, it annoys me that when one enters the configuration menus, if you don't press something within a few seconds it kicks back out. One has to remember to press buttons for no reason to to give it a "keep alive" signal. They got the auto-off in the wrong place. :-)

 

btw, I am actively pursuing room issues on the Axiom forum (my speakers are Axiom M80 v2).

 

That's correct. The only way to enter the eq adjustment is manually. I used REW to suggest what frequency to apply the adjustments. We don't have many bands, so I chose the ones closest to the REW recommendations. In regards to narrow or wide, I tried both and just re-measured with REW; with such a simple and effective tool, there isn't a need to really know how wide or narrow the Q is.

 

Even though I'm big on neutral, flat measuring speakers, the reality is that I didn't tune out all of the bass modes and left the bass a few db higher than the high frequencies. For the music I listen to, I like a bit of extra weight down low. One of my modes is +12db. I used the bass EQ to bring it down -6db and the measurements showed exactly +6db after.

[hpm200]

Hello, I have enjoyed reading this thread, there are not many out there pertaining to the NAD C390DD. I am running a desktop computer through it.

 

The computer consists of an Asus Z87-Plus mother board, a 4^th Gen Intel I5 CPU , 16 gigs of ram, and a Thermaltake water 2.0 liquid cooling kit.

 

an SSD drive for the C: drive and for digital file storage two 3 terabyte sata drives.

 

An Esi Juli@xte sound card using Asio 2.0 - Esi Juli@xte

Jriver ver. 21.xxx for playback and resampling. I found that running the adaptive volume in night mode gives better volume levels.

 

Pioneer PL-514 turntable with an Ortofon red cartridge.

 

Nad PP4 USB Preamp to allow me to rip albums and playback LP’s. I will be purchasing the Nad Preamp module for the C390DD later so the turntable can be ran directly through the C390DD, bypassing the computer.

 

Speakers are a set of Pioneer HPM 200s. For speaker wire I use the the 35 cent a foot speaker wire off the spool that most shops sell. I found by separating the two individual strands there is a surprising improvement in the sound. A friend who used to design speakers and sound systems convinced me to try that rather than spending big bucks on speaker wiring and he was certainly right about it.

 

All the equipment is run through a Surgex XR315 Surge eliminator/power conditioner which has made a definite difference to the sound quality. I also found that by shutting off the onboard sound card via the bios and moving the Esi sound card to farthest pci-e slot away from the computer power supply a lot of computer noise was eliminated. Sometime I plan on removing the power supply to outside of the computer case.

 

The Esi Juli@xte plays back up to 192 khz 64 bit when using a Coaxial S/PDIF cable and though the Toslink connection is rated by the manufacture to play back at only 96 khz, I found that by using a $30.00 Toslink cable, It will playback at 192 khz 64 bit. Esi support has acknowledged that depending on your equipment that this is factual. I am able to resample record playback in 192khz 64 bit even though I am using a Usb preamp. When playing records I have found to get the best quality sound via this Dac I shut off the Equalization in the C390DD and I keep the bass and treble settings in the neutral position at all times and I don’t use any software equalization via Jriver.

 

While I intend to upgrade the computer configuration, the turntable and the preamp as my budget allows, the Nad C390DD along with the speakers will never be sold. The Nad is a great unit and I feel that in terms of bang for your dollar it’s a definite winner.

[chauphuong]

Maybe I am an unlucky user of Nad 390dd. I used to feed it by an Oppo 103 as transport through coaxial, and had to turn the volume knob to half of its range to have decent sound in a 11m2 room. My speakers are a pair of PSB Synchrony One B - 6ohm, 88db.

 

After sometime I bought a Marantz PM 7005 and things changed all the way, from sound level to SQ.

[hpm200]

Hello chauphuong

 

You are not the first to have that problem with the Nad C390DD. A number of people initially had the same problem about the Nad and were talking about it on the different blogs and hifi sites. Some sent the machine back because of this issue. I have to ask did you go into the Nads menu and select Speaker Compensation and set it to the correct impedance? I see that yours are rated for minimum 4 ohms and nominal 6 ohms.

 

If I recall correctly it comes set to 8 ohm by default and can be set from 2 ohms to 8 ohms and it does make a huge difference according to the people who changed to the correct ohm. setting for their speakers.I hope you still have the Nad so you can try that solution.

 

Another thing that I found was that when the machine was new it didn't have the range and tone that it has now, I know some say that there is no such thing as a break in period with stereo equipment but my experience say they are wrong, as time went on , a few month of playing made a real difference and when I first recieved it it had the first firmware version and when I changed the firmware version to version 2.88 that also made a big difference. Hope this helps.

 

Mike

[chauphuong]

Thanks. I must say I did do everything to no avail. In fact I used it for 1.5 years. Now the machine is in the package. Will update to 2.88 to see what happen.

[hpm200]

Hello chauphuong

 

I downloaded a copy of your Oppo 103 manual to see if there might be some setting that could maybe causing trouble .Haven't read the complete manual but I did see this and I wonder if it might have some bearing in your problem?

 

Due to bandwidth limitations, high resolution audio formats such as Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD High Resolution and DTS-HD Master Audio cannot be sent through the coaxial or optical digital audio output. A reduced resolution version of the same audio trackwill be output instead. To listen to high resolution audio formats in their best quality, please use the HDMI connection if you have a receiver that handles HDMI audio (see page 11) oruse the multi-channel analog outputs if you do not (see page 16).Due to copyright restrictions, SACD audio cannot be sent through the coaxial or optical digital audio output. To listen to SACDs, please use the HDMI or analog audio connections.Due to copyright restrictions and bandwidth limitations, full resolution audio from DVD-Audio Discs cannot be sent through the coaxial or optical digital audio output. To listen to DVD Audio in full resolution, please use the HDMI or analog audio connections.

 

 

Mike

[chauphuong]

Hi, my Oppo 103 only served as a transporter of flac, wav, ape, and dsf files into NAD through a coaxial cable, so nothing about DTS, Dolby etc was involved here. In fact I have sold the Oppo and put NAD into my warehouse. Now my transporter is an audio grade PC. I will unpack NAD C390 again to update the new firmware and hook it to the audio PC through a USB cable, just to see if the "weak volume" problem is there or not.

[fc-racer]

In fact I have sold the Oppo and put NAD into my warehouse. Now my transporter is an audio grade PC. I will unpack NAD C390 again to update the new firmware and hook it to the audio PC through a USB cable, just to see if the "weak volume" problem is there or not.

 

The key is whether you can obtain satisfactory volume levels within the range of -80 to +10db. Volume controllers have no set standards in amplifiers. Some manufacturers use volume controls that give you 100% of the output capability of the amplifier just before clipping at 1/3 rotation of the dial. This is purely done for marketing reasons to make people believe the amplifier is more powerful. They use the same trick in cars where the first 1/3 of the accelerator pedal travel provides 90% of the signal to the throttle body.

 

Both the amplifiers I now use in my homes have honest implementations of volume control. This means that you ignore where the volume is within the range, but instead focus on whether you can reach the volume levels you want within the range available. This is a much better way of doing things and I appreciate both NAD and Creek Audio for setting up their volume controllers in this more honest way.

 

I should note that I've used the NAD C390DD with 86db speakers and I could get enough volume out of them that I can't imagine anyone wishing for anything more unless they had a very large room. The Creek 100A has a bit less headroom and I can hear some compression at very high volume levels with 86db speakers. With 89db speakers, both amplifiers provide more than enough sound volume.