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krass76

headphones or monitors (boooring, I know, but still)

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Hey,

I'm infront of a rather big investment.

I want to be able to produce music and right now I'm looking at buying monitors (which is alwas recommended, I know) or headphones.

Now the problem I have is that I can not treat my room (and it is quite small), maybe hang a couple of rugs on the walls and that's about it.

For this reason I'm leaning towards the K712 by AKG as they seem to be intended for what I plan on doing and don't depend on the accoustics of the room I'm in.

 

The other alternative would be to get a couple of Yamaha HS 8 (I quite frankly need the low end's extension of the 8 inch version) and connect them right into my UR22 via XLR, whilst with the headphones I'd be going from the UR22 into a Heed Canamp via RCA and then into the K712.

 

What would you pick? Do you see any alternatives?

Any responses would be greatly appreciated!

 

EDIT: Just to specify, for me it isn't just about the frequency curve but also for the amount of details I will be able to judge the sound by as either the headphones or the monitors will be my main / only way of judging the productions.

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cookie-npr-behind-board.jpg?itok=yGdsFBw

this one?

 

mind you that I have to stay within a certain price bracket (500 bucks for both active speakers) and my main question is whether in an untreated room I should get monitors or headphones..for production and such

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Hey Krass......for 2 channel mix down, headphones aren't going to cut it at all. You won't be able to effectively create a sounstage or stable stereo mix with phones. In your price range I strongly recommend JBL LSR308's.

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Agree with Mayhem13, for mixing and/or mastering it will be very difficult to do accurately on cans. You might think it sounds sweet, and then play it back on another system and it might sound jacked or thin. For mucking about and playing with ideas and sound design it works fine and will keep family and neighbours sane. But a simple Sennheiser HD280pro $80 one will work fine. For monitors a 2nd hand small pair of BM5A Dynaudios works great.

 

Cheers

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so right now I'm thinking about buying either the yamaha hs 8 or the jbl lsr 308. As I need an alrounder I'm leaning towards the jbls as they are said to have decent high, mids and lows. And they perfectly fit my budget, too. Two of them with free shiping would cost me exactly 500 bucks (euros, that is) which is fine for me. But I like to listen/make music at quite low volumes, can I assume them to do that too?

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Just for fun, here is a link where you can listen online and compare a whole bunch of powered studio monitors:

 

Studio Monitor Comparison - Full Resolution Samples

 

It if was in the market and looking to maximize bang-for-the-buck, no question at all: JBL LSR series

 

 

And I would also consider getting these stands for them:

 

Video introduction to ISO-L8R155 speaker stands

 

Video introduction to ISO-L8R155 speaker stands


Home: EtherRegen + Farad Super3 LPS | UltraRendu + Uptone LPS 1.2 | Berkeley Alpha USB | Denafrips Terminator | Jeff Rowland Coherence II Series 2 pre | Blue Circle Audio BC-202 amp | Raidho XT-1 | 2 x Revel Performa3 B112 subwoofers  

 

Desktop: Iso Regen + LPS 1 | Eitr | Chord Qutest  | Aesthetix Calypso pre | Blue Circle Audio BC-28 amp | Scansonic MK-5 monitors | Elac S10 sub

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so then I'll go with the lsr 308. but for a stand (will put them behind my desk as it isn't exactly that deep) I can't seem to find one with a base large enough. will they be okay on a stand the base of which is only 23x23cm (rated at 30kg) whilst the loudspeakers "footprint" is 25x30cm and the weigh only around 8kg? it seems stands with exactly that size are designed to hold a 50kg monster of a speaker and are too expensive for my needs (150 bucks)

will the smaller base be a problem? and is there any way to mount these onto one of these speaker tripods?

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Stand them on whatever you like as long as it's stable......the large 8" woofer will develop some intertia so you don't want them moving at all. Measurements indicate the listening axis smoothest at about 15 degrees from center on the horizontal,and vertical on axis directly inline with the the bottom edge of the waveguide. A picture of your console and throne would help.

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this is my desk

IMGP4472.jpg

taken with 27mm (18mm @ APS-C)

 

"console" yeah.. atleast there are some knobs and faders there, just not sure whether it's a "console" .D

my room is quite small but I can and plan on move my desk further back a bit. don't mind the scufs on the chair, we got a cat. but it doesn't seem to chew on cables, reliefingly! .D

and I know you might instantaneously yell "BEDROOM PRODUCER!!!" at me and try to stone me but everyone has to start somewhere...

a note on the speakers: they have an incredible low end extension to ca. 65hz and ARE NOT monitors! they just have the normal "consumer-friendly" frequency curve and, compared to my hd650, just sound muddy. another thing is that the amp they're hooked up to has, as it is an older one, an audible background hiss (really just white noise) that drives me nuts.

the hd650 are the old ones that have the "sennheiser veil" in its full glory. being hooked up to a heed canamp doesn't help. generally it's even the wrong amp for a hd650 but the only I could get back then.

so I'll be selling the hd650 and the canamp and then replace the current amp and speaker combo with two jbls lsr 308 which I plan to get stands for so they don't eat my precious desk space.

and I know that the tweeter should be at ear height and you have to form the 60°-triangle.

 

and for the stands:

most probably I will get these ones (just ignore the german, the numbers are what counts):

http://www.amazon.de/ah-Stands-SKDB039-Boxenst%C3%A4nder/dp/B004BR2XOO/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1408175527&sr=8-8&keywords=lautsprecher+st%C3%A4nder

 

will it be good for the jbls?

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this is my desk

[ATTACH=CONFIG]14137[/ATTACH]

taken with 27mm (18mm @ APS-C)

 

"console" yeah.. atleast there are some knobs and faders there, just not sure whether it's a "console" .D

my room is quite small but I can and plan on move my desk further back a bit. don't mind the scufs on the chair, we got a cat. but it doesn't seem to chew on cables, reliefingly! .D

and I know you might instantaneously yell "BEDROOM PRODUCER!!!" at me and try to stone me but everyone has to start somewhere...

a note on the speakers: they have an incredible low end extension to ca. 65hz and ARE NOT monitors! they just have the normal "consumer-friendly" frequency curve and, compared to my hd650, just sound muddy. another thing is that the amp they're hooked up to has, as it is an older one, an audible background hiss (really just white noise) that drives me nuts.

the hd650 are the old ones that have the "sennheiser veil" in its full glory. being hooked up to a heed canamp doesn't help. generally it's even the wrong amp for a hd650 but the only I could get back then.

so I'll be selling the hd650 and the canamp and then replace the current amp and speaker combo with two jbls lsr 308 which I plan to get stands for so they don't eat my precious desk space.

and I know that the tweeter should be at ear height and you have to form the 60°-triangle.

 

and for the stands:

most probably I will get these ones (just ignore the german, the numbers are what counts):

http://www.amazon.de/ah-Stands-SKDB039-Boxenst%C3%A4nder/dp/B004BR2XOO/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1408175527&sr=8-8&keywords=lautsprecher+st%C3%A4nder

 

will it be good for the jbls?

 

Stands should be fine. Get a soft roll down shade for that window ASAP and get the desk in front of the window.

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I do have a roldown shade and actually use it quite frequently. But why should my desk go infront of the window? my room is (from the orientation the picture is at) longer than it is wide and what you aren't seeing on the picture is that there is my bed-sofa-combo right behind the position from which I've taken the photo, in parallel to the desk, and at ear-height, there are some big pillows (the foam isn't exactly heavy but still)

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Hi krass76,

 

A couple of other ideas for space and speaker height.

 

IKEA sells these aluminium legs on which you can attach any size planks.

 

CAPITA Leg - 4 3/8 " - IKEA

 

Desktops - GALANT/BEKANT system - IKEA

 

If you put a thin plank at the back you create a bit more desktop space and can raise the speakers a bit if need be. Another space saver is hanging your lcd screen from a VESA mount so it does not use up desk space.

For example:

Long Reach Monitor LCD Arms Wall Mount, Desk Mounts, Pole Mounts Monitors

 

Sweetwater has a few desks as examples:

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/c686--Studio_Desks_Workstations

 

Cheers

Edited by tranz

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my rooms dimensions are 3.3m * 4.5m (9ft10in * 14ft9in), if that helps. my desk is parallel to the short side of the room.

I also moved my desk to the middle of the room.

as I'll be using stands which can go from 91cm to 150cm, speaker height isn't really a problem.

and thanks for the vesa tip, my monitor has vesa-holes (100mm) so I'll just use a cheap speaker-tripod with a vesa mount on top to get my screen off my desk (I always wanted to do that as when going 1m back from my table I can still read everything perfectly fine and for a 24in monitor it is quite close anyways)

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my rooms dimensions are 3.3m * 4.5m (9ft10in * 14ft9in), if that helps. my desk is parallel to the short side of the room.

I also moved my desk to the middle of the room.

as I'll be using stands which can go from 91cm to 150cm, speaker height isn't really a problem.

and thanks for the vesa tip, my monitor has vesa-holes (100mm) so I'll just use a cheap speaker-tripod with a vesa mount on top to get my screen off my desk (I always wanted to do that as when going 1m back from my table I can still read everything perfectly fine and for a 24in monitor it is quite close anyways)

 

Try to listen where the bass is most even in the room. In the middle of a room the bass always cuts out becuase of standing waves patterns... Use your ears and don't think "yourself" into producing music. Good luck young jedi! :)

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...I know that the tweeter should be at ear height and you have to form the 60°-triangle.

 

You don't *know* that, you've been *told* that. It's good to have the tweeter at a reasonable height, but the 60 degree toe-in idea is usually wrong. It's a band-aid for lousy acoustics, and it will destroy soundstaging in most cases. Try less toe-in.

 

The critical thing, in every case, is to time-align your speakers. With 2-ways, whether or not paired with subs, you can always accomplish it with positioning (tilting). I like to use a nice tom-tom hit and listen for truest reproduction.

Edited by Sam Lord

Mac Mini 2012 with 2.3 GHz i5 CPU and 16GB RAM running newest OS10.9x and Signalyst HQ Player software (occasionally JRMC), ethernet to Cisco SG100-08 GigE switch, ethernet to SOtM SMS100 Miniserver in audio room, sending via short 1/2 meter AQ Cinnamon USB to Oppo 105D, feeding balanced outputs to 2x Bel Canto S300 amps which vertically biamp ATC SCM20SL speakers, 2x Velodyne DD12+ subs. Each side is mounted vertically on 3-tiered Sound Anchor ADJ2 stands: ATC (top), amp (middle), sub (bottom), Mogami, Koala, Nordost, Mosaic cables, split at the preamp outputs with splitters. All transducers are thoroughly and lovingly time aligned for the listening position.

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