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Phasure NOS1a DAC


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11 hours ago, manisandher said:

Congrats Jonathan. And you have the latest G3 upgrade, which is simply phenomenal. I'll be posting about it soon...

 

Sorry I wasn't able to help out - your request for help/ideas on the Phasure forum came just as I was travelling a lot for work. And in any event, I've never used the NOS1a with an NAA (in the way I think you mean). In my office, I use HQPlayer on a high-powered dedicated audio PC (28-thread Xeon running Win10 from RAM - runs totally cool with only passive cooling) which feeds the NOS1a there. I have Roon on the music server in my basement, which feeds HQPlayer via the network. It works very, very well. I love the usability of Roon/Tidal, and the flexibility of being able to feed any of combination of HQP's filters @705.6/768 and noise-shapers to the NOS1a. But for my main system, I stick with XXHighEnd, because it sounds so good.

 

Congrats again.

 

Mani.

 

Not sure if I know what the "G3 upgrade is" but my listening so far is really fantastic. The level of detail is impressive and I'm going to continue to listen longer to get a full impression. Sounds like a cliche but I'm hearing details in recordings that I haven't heard before. I am extremely impressed with the ability of the XXHE Engine to perform on my low powered machine!

 

Have you compared the CPU needs of HQPlayer vs. XXHE? Not fair because DSD is its own thing, and HQPlayer does some really special things but nonetheless XXEngine3 is running with 10% of my dual Celeron CPU and in 24mb memory while upsampling 44100 to 705600!

 

It would be *ahem* interesting if @PeterSt could let XXEngine3 run on one machine and control over the network...

Custom room treatments for headphone users.

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4 hours ago, jabbr said:

Have you compared the CPU needs of HQPlayer vs. XXHE? Not fair because DSD is its own thing, and HQPlayer does some really special things but nonetheless XXEngine3 is running with 10% of my dual Celeron CPU and in 24mb memory while upsampling 44100 to 705600!

 

Why don't you just try? ;)

 

Upsampling 44.1k to 705.6k on Intel Atom CPU or similar is not a problem.

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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6 hours ago, jabbr said:

It would be *ahem* interesting if @PeterSt could let XXEngine3 run on one machine and control over the network...

 

There is (or at least was) a two-computer setup for XXHE - best place to look is on the Phasure forums and/or ask Peter there.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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7 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Why don't you just try? ;)

 

Upsampling 44.1k to 705.6k on Intel Atom CPU or similar is not a problem.

 

I would if I could but can't get networkaudiod properly working with the NOS1a -- not networkaudiod's issue rather than the "good" driver is kernel streaming not WASAPI... oh boy I am learning Windows details I never thought I would, or actually I *remember* when kernel streaming came out decades ago ...

 

What would be terrific would be a common network transport layer for audio drivers -- like the NAA protocol -- does just what it needs to do unlike AES67/Ravenna which, although does transport audio for playback, is unnecessarily complex for what we want to do. So I'd rather have a stripped down protocol that does just what is needed, i.e. NAA ;)

Custom room treatments for headphone users.

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2 hours ago, jabbr said:

I would if I could but can't get networkaudiod properly working with the NOS1a -- not networkaudiod's issue rather than the "good" driver is kernel streaming not WASAPI... oh boy I am learning Windows details I never thought I would, or actually I *remember* when kernel streaming came out decades ago ...

 

Maybe @manisandher can help. The backends available through networkaudiod are exactly same as the ones available through HQPlayer itself. And I've heard that HQPlayer works with NOS1a...

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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On 5/22/2017 at 5:00 AM, jabbr said:

Not sure if I know what the "G3 upgrade is" but my listening so far is really fantastic.

 

If you have the G3 upgrade, there'll be 'G3' written at the front in the middle, above the 'a'. I'll be writing about the NOS1 G3 shortly - PeterSt has created a masterpiece that I'm confident would compare favourably with any DAC at any price.

 

On 5/22/2017 at 5:00 AM, jabbr said:

Have you compared the CPU needs of HQPlayer vs. XXHE? Not fair because DSD is its own thing, and HQPlayer does some really special things but nonetheless XXEngine3 is running with 10% of my dual Celeron CPU and in 24mb memory while upsampling 44100 to 705600!

 

No I haven't. I don't use DSD, but upsample to PCM 705.6/768 in either XXHighEnd (main system) and HQPlayer (office system). In the latter case, I also use HQP's NS5 noise-shaping. Both the respective audio PCs are powerful Xeon machines, but even so, running under XXHE's 'Min OS' mode in both cases, they operate just above ambient room temperature with only passive cooling. Having Win10 running entirely from RAM (no HDDs/SDDs in audio PC) helps too. I think both are just 'ticking over', irrespective of how much audio DSP they're asked to perform before sending the signal to the NOS1. But I'm sure XXHE running in its 'Unattended' mode would be using a lot less CPU resources than HQP, as in this mode, virtually everything in the audio PC is killed before playback starts.

 

On 5/22/2017 at 5:00 AM, jabbr said:

It would be *ahem* interesting if @PeterSt could let XXEngine3 run on one machine and control over the network...

 

Interesting perhaps, but unnecessary, IMO. Apart from the cost (perhaps a consideration, but I doubt it at this level of performance), there is simply no reason that I can see for going the ultra-low-footprint NAA route over what I currently have. As I said, my audio PCs run very cool with only passive cooling, and draw very little mains power. They are totally silent, as they contain no fans/HDDs/SSDs, and run totally headless (no GPU in either PC). The Phasure audio PC also uses a built-in linear power supply.

 

I did use a Linux NAA with HQPlayer for quite a while, many years ago now. But I got frustrated with not being able to use the DACs I wanted to, due to a lack of Linux drivers.

 

Mani.

Main: SOtM sMS-200 -> Okto dac8PRO -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horns + 2x Rotel RB-1590 amps -> 4 subs

Home Office: SOtM sMS-200 -> MOTU UltraLite-mk5 -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Impulse H2 speakers

Vinyl: Technics SP10 / London (Decca) Reference -> Trafomatic Luna -> RME ADI-2 Pro

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15 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Maybe @manisandher can help. The backends available through networkaudiod are exactly same as the ones available through HQPlayer itself. And I've heard that HQPlayer works with NOS1a...

 

 

Unfortunately, I'm of no help here - I've never used the NOS1 with networkaudiod, only with W10/HQP-Desktop. I'm very happy with the result I'm getting in my office system: Roon (on music server) -> direct ethernet connection -> HQP (on audio PC) works absolutely perfectly.

 

Mani.

Main: SOtM sMS-200 -> Okto dac8PRO -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horns + 2x Rotel RB-1590 amps -> 4 subs

Home Office: SOtM sMS-200 -> MOTU UltraLite-mk5 -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Impulse H2 speakers

Vinyl: Technics SP10 / London (Decca) Reference -> Trafomatic Luna -> RME ADI-2 Pro

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6 minutes ago, manisandher said:

But I'm sure XXHE running in its 'Unattended' mode would be using a lot less CPU resources than HQP, as in this mode, virtually everything in the audio PC is killed before playback starts.

 

Yes.  Though as I mentioned above I believe somewhere along the way there's been a two-PC setup, XXHE can pretty well tune the extraneous processes in a single PC down to nothing.  Then the idea would be, rather than using a minimal machine such as an NAA, using just a fraction of a more capable machine's capacity.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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20 minutes ago, Jud said:

Though as I mentioned above I believe somewhere along the way there's been a two-PC setup...

 

Jud, I can't remember ever doing that. But perhaps it's just my memory failing me...

 

Mani.

Main: SOtM sMS-200 -> Okto dac8PRO -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Tune Audio Anima horns + 2x Rotel RB-1590 amps -> 4 subs

Home Office: SOtM sMS-200 -> MOTU UltraLite-mk5 -> 6x Neurochrome 286 mono amps -> Impulse H2 speakers

Vinyl: Technics SP10 / London (Decca) Reference -> Trafomatic Luna -> RME ADI-2 Pro

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1 minute ago, manisandher said:

 

Jud, I can't remember ever doing that. But perhaps it's just my memory failing me...

 

Mani.

 

I don't recall you doing it either. ;)

 

But I thought I might have remembered Peter alluding to it.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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1 hour ago, manisandher said:

 

If you have the G3 upgrade, there'll be 'G3' written at the front in the middle, above the 'a'. I'll be writing about the NOS1 G3 shortly - PeterSt has created a masterpiece that I'm confident would compare favourably with any DAC at any price.

 

 

Hasn't he just!  The G3 manages to astound me every day...wow.

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3 hours ago, manisandher said:

Interesting perhaps, but unnecessary, IMO. Apart from the cost (perhaps a consideration, but I doubt it at this level of performance), there is simply no reason that I can see for going the ultra-low-footprint NAA route over what I currently have. As I said, my audio PCs run very cool with only passive cooling, and draw very little mains power. They are totally silent, as they contain no fans/HDDs/SSDs, and run totally headless (no GPU in either PC). The Phasure audio PC also uses a built-in linear power supply.

 

I did use a Linux NAA with HQPlayer for quite a while, many years ago now. But I got frustrated with not being able to use the DACs I wanted to, due to a lack of Linux drivers.

 

Aside from the ability to use a Windows NAA with Windows drivers (either WASAPI or ASIO), my reasons are different. The current "world" of DACs uses USB input ... and despite the very excellent efforts of many, we continue to see various "improvements" made to the USB interface, often with add on boxes.

 

In the future, including near future, we are seeing increasing use of direct Ethernet interfaces for DACs. What will these look like? Various things perhaps, though it is interesting that Merging has announced a very similar approach to the one I have been working on: using the Xilinx Zynq (pretty much very similar hardware to the Merging ZMan) and I can tell you that the driver does so called "kernel streaming" in hardware... you just write the bits to memory and send DMA...

 

So anyways I am asking "what's possible" but have reasons for asking the question that are my own reasons...

Custom room treatments for headphone users.

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1 hour ago, jabbr said:

 

Aside from the ability to use a Windows NAA with Windows drivers (either WASAPI or ASIO), my reasons are different. The current "world" of DACs uses USB input ... and despite the very excellent efforts of many, we continue to see various "improvements" made to the USB interface, often with add on boxes.

 

In the future, including near future, we are seeing increasing use of direct Ethernet interfaces for DACs. What will these look like? Various things perhaps, though it is interesting that Merging has announced a very similar approach to the one I have been working on: using the Xilinx Zynq (pretty much very similar hardware to the Merging ZMan) and I can tell you that the driver does so called "kernel streaming" in hardware... you just write the bits to memory and send DMA...

 

So anyways I am asking "what's possible" but have reasons for asking the question that are my own reasons...

 

Up to now Peter has done a couple of "end to end" solutions.  Back in the day he had the end of a Juli@ sound card sticking out of the DAC IIRC; now he's using async USB.  I don't think he's necessarily wedded to that, any more than he was to the Juli@ solution.  But about future plans, as well as what may be possible now with a two-box solution, you would have to ask Peter.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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