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Yes that works without issue as long as you select a filter that can do the conversion. My point is that the auto setting is of no value to those without a dac that can do all rates as it will pick rates not compatible. Not a complaint just an observation.

 

Do you mean something like for example:

5.6 limit set in Settings

closed form filter set

Auto set in sample rate combo box of main window

playlist with 2 tracks

1. 44.k base recording ... it is converted to 5.6 MHz, that's OK

2. 48k base recording ... it does not play on your DAC

 

Because of 5.6 limit and Auto sample rate setting, the 2nd track is probably converted to 3.1, which your DAC does not support.

Is that your case?

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Do you mean something like for example:

5.6 limit set in Settings

closed form filter set

Auto set in sample rate combo box of main window

playlist with 2 tracks

1. 44.k base recording ... it is converted to 5.6 MHz, that's OK

2. 48k base recording ... it does not play on your DAC

 

Because of 5.6 limit and Auto sample rate setting, the 2nd track is probably converted to 3.1, which your DAC does not support.

Is that your case?

 

Yes that is the case. It would effect anyone with a dac that does not support those rates. I realize that an increasing number of dacs support all rates but the market is not there yet. Could be a function of dac itself or the driver. I don't really consider this a problem as I can manually select a combination that works for data that is 24/96 but I can see how the term "auto" could be misleading as it is only auto if your dac supports all rates.

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Yes that is the case. It would effect anyone with a dac that does not support those rates. I realize that an increasing number of dacs support all rates but the market is not there yet. Could be a function of dac itself or the driver. I don't really consider this a problem as I can manually select a combination that works for data that is 24/96 but I can see how the term "auto" could be misleading as it is only auto if your dac supports all rates.

 

Chodi, I would interpret your situation otherwise:

 

In HQPlayer, you cannot play 48k base PCM recordings as DSD on your DAC with filters, which can do only integer multiple of sample rate. No way for you how to play such files as DSD in HQPlayer on your DAC with this category of filters. So I would say your issue is related to your DAC capabilities in relation to filter selection and not so to 'Auto' setting. But I agree, 'Auto' sample rate selection is useless for you, as it's purpose is to adapt output to sample rate family of source recording and your DAC doesn't support both families for DSD output.

 

With my Foobar to HQPlayer solution, you could do conversion of all 48k base PCM content to 44.1k base PCM content to RAM disk and then you could let HQPlayer to play it from RAM disk - all automated. It would involve PCM content resampling outside of HQPlayer.

Edited by bogi

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Agree with Chodi...I am having the same issue. I thought what auto will do is pick the highest rate that my DAC is capable of. But perhaps that info is not reported to HQPlayer and so HQPlayer is not aware. Maybe a solution is to allow the user to save all the DSD and PCM rates the DAC is capable of as a setting/preference. Or HQPlayer can have a database of DAC's us users can contribute to.

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I sure did thank you ! The issue was that I use VNC to the Mac Mini and my large music library was causing a lot of latency. Once I got past that I got it working fine. I tried the Poly sinc and then the closed form briefly up sampling my red book stuff to 176.4khz. To my ears - and it was a brief listen - the closed form produced a level of performance that I heard as more coherent. I am excited to experiment more

 

What filter do u prefer ? I pinged Metric Halo earlier to see if their coming 3D upgrade will provide enhanced sonics.

 

Glad to hear you got it worked out! I like poly sinc mp-2s or poly sinc 2s

 

Please post what MH had to say as I too have been wondering about that issue.


Intel i7-6700 PC Server, NUC7CJYH w. 8g Ballistix ram as Renderer/LPS 1.2 - IsoRegen/LPS-1/LPS1 - AQVox Galvanic USB/LPS1 - Singxer SU-1/LPS1 - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC - LTA MicroZOTL MZ2 - Modwright KWA 150 Signature Amp - Tidal Audio Piano's.  

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I read that HQP has MPRIS support. I would like to control HQP with an on screen applet called "Now Playing" which is found in the "Screenlets" program under Linux. The "Now Playing" applet requires three fields to be filled in with information regarding the media player to be controlled via MPRIS. Below is a sample of the information needed to control the "Guayadeque" player in Ubuntu 14.04LTS.

 

Only HQPlayer Embedded supports MPRIS. It is compliant with the specification, so there is no need to set any information and it should work with any control application that follows the specification.


Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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Agree with Chodi...I am having the same issue. I thought what auto will do is pick the highest rate that my DAC is capable of. But perhaps that info is not reported to HQPlayer and so HQPlayer is not aware. Maybe a solution is to allow the user to save all the DSD and PCM rates the DAC is capable of as a setting/preference. Or HQPlayer can have a database of DAC's us users can contribute to.

 

Sometimes, especially with DoP what DAC reports is not coherent with what it actually supports. For example Marantz HD-DAC1 claims to support 176.4/192/352.8/384k PCM rates while it actually works with DSD only using 176.4 (2.8M) and 352.8 (5.6M) rates. There shouldn't be any technical reason for that behavior, it is just some annoying firmware limitation. This is especially annoying because it has lower jitter with 48-base clocks than 44.1-base...

 

Sometimes it is other way around, for example iFi DACs work fine with 48k-base DSD rates, but the Windows ASIO driver is limits this set to 44.1k-base DSD rates. On Linux or Mac there is no such limitation...


Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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If some PCM file is not playable on your DAC as DSD with some specific filter, how could the new 'Auto' feature change this fact?

 

'Auto' in the output mode combo box is reserved for "Play PCM as PCM, DSD as DSD". But that doesn't seem to be Chodi's wish to play ALL PCM as PCM.

 

I could imagine this solution:

 

If Auto is set in the sample rate combo box AND if SDM(DSD) is set in output mode combo box AND if non apodizing filter is set AND if source file is 48k base PCM AND if 48k base DSD rates are not playable on the connected DAC then temporarily switch output mode to PCM AND adapt output sample rate for this file.

 

Somehow complicated ... do you have a better suggestion, how it could function?

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Chodi, I would interpret your situation otherwise:

 

In HQPlayer, you cannot play 48k base PCM recordings as DSD on your DAC with filters, which can do only integer multiple of sample rate. No way for you how to play such files as DSD in HQPlayer on your DAC with this category of filters. So I would say your issue is related to your DAC capabilities in relation to filter selection and not so to 'Auto' setting. But I agree, 'Auto' sample rate selection is useless for you, as it's purpose is to adapt output to sample rate family of source recording and your DAC doesn't support both families for DSD output.

 

With my Foobar to HQPlayer solution, you could do conversion of all 48k base PCM content to 44.1k base PCM content to RAM disk and then you could let HQPlayer to play it from RAM disk - all automated. It would involve PCM content resampling outside of HQPlayer.

 

Actually that's how I do this. I play everything from ramdisk anyway so I load the source file using Xrecode II and let it resample the source to 88200 then all filters work with my dac. Only takes about 30 seconds even for a large file to do this.

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The convolution setup and matrix are sort of mutually exclusive, but they share the filter setup. So you can also configure everything in matrix setup, but selecting the filter files may be a bit more convenient in convolution dialog. Convolution setup dialog covers the first 8 virtual channels of matrix.

 

I will try to clarify this in the manual.

 

Thanks. I've got the system working with this involving ROON + HQ Player on a server and dedicated NAA connected to the e18 DAC. My server is an upgraded CAPS Zuma V3 with settings (PCM) being poly-sinc-shrt-mp / NS5 / 384kHz with 96kHz filters generated from Acourate. The current issue is that whilst it's all working I'm hearing crackle / static on occasion. My first thought was that this might be because the server is under-powered but that doesn't seem to be the case as the latency on start-up is only about 5-10sec whilst CPU is running at 25% and Memory at 3.5G of 8G. Any ideas on how to diagnosis the issue would be much appreciated.

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Thanks. I've got the system working with this involving ROON + HQ Player on a server and dedicated NAA connected to the e18 DAC. My server is an upgraded CAPS Zuma V3 with settings (PCM) being poly-sinc-shrt-mp / NS5 / 384kHz with 96kHz filters generated from Acourate. The current issue is that whilst it's all working I'm hearing crackle / static on occasion. My first thought was that this might be because the server is under-powered but that doesn't seem to be the case as the latency on start-up is only about 5-10sec whilst CPU is running at 25% and Memory at 3.5G of 8G. Any ideas on how to diagnosis the issue would be much appreciated.

 

I would start to get chain components out of the picture and gradually restrict possible causes. For example, try direct connection with no NAA involved; not use Roon; simpler upsampling at 4x and then 2x; ...

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So I've been in search of the holy grail of DSD512 with my IFI micro iDSD...I know there are a bunch of others out there too.

 

My mac mini 2012 (2.3gHz i7; intel graphics) isn't close.

 

Then I went to a Mac Pro (2.3gHz 8-core; GTX780 cuda)...that was a lot closer but still stuttered.

 

Then I went to a Dell Precision T5600 (2.6gHz 16-core; 48 GB RAM; Quadro 4000...so no CUDA for HQplayer) with Ubuntu Studio 14.04 installed on a Samsung 850 SSD...that was really close...only showing about 18-19% processer...but it still stutters...definitely the closest I've gotten with polysinc-2s.

 

My final assault is to add a MSI GTX970 for CUDA...but if that doesn't do it...I'm going to try to forget about this and be content with DSD256.

 

I should also mention that I use NAA's for actual playback my IFI...currently a Sonicorbiter SE running HQplayer.

 

Am I missing something? Jussi...I think you mentioned that you had to turn graphics off with your E5 and CUDA card to get there? How do I do that?

 

Robert


Software: Roon/HQplayer; System I: Roon Server/HQplayer DSD 512 Upsampling, Custom Windows 10 PC/AO, LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; Holo Cyan DAC; VPI Scout 2 Turntable, Soundsmith Boheme, TTW Clamps and Carbon Matt; Cary SLP-98P Preamp; Van Alstine FET 600 Poweramp;  Aerial Acoustics 6T loudspeakers, SVS SB13 Ultra Subwoofers. System II: Custom PC with Signalyst Linux HQplayer NAA; LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; IFI Micro iDSD Black Label; Primaluna Dialogue 2 with Tung Sol KT-150; Paradigm Studio 20 v3 monitors on Custom Mapleshade stands. Cables: Moon Audio, LUSH, Kimber Kable, Mapleshade, LARRY custom.

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... Then I went to a Dell Precision T5600 (2.6gHz 16-core; 48 GB RAM; Quadro 4000...so no CUDA for HQplayer) with Ubuntu Studio 14.04 installed on a Samsung 850 SSD...that was really close...only showing about 18-19% processer...but it still stutters...definitely the closest I've gotten with polysinc-2s...

 

Robert

 

I just landed into DSD256 capabilities with MacBookPro 11,4 and I think is enough for me ... :-)

 

I'm a laptop fan and I don't want to use desktop unit for music processing. In any case I'm curios to understand why a Quadro 4000 can't be used for HQP computation, I was thinking that 3.0 capabilities are enough. Isn't it ?

 

Have a nice day. Massimiliano

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So I've been in search of the holy grail of DSD512 with my IFI micro iDSD...I know there are a bunch of others out there too.

 

My mac mini 2012 (2.3gHz i7; intel graphics) isn't close.

 

Yes, probably won't be able to do DSD512... I think it should do DSD256 just fine with -2s filters.

 

Then I went to a Dell Precision T5600 (2.6gHz 16-core; 48 GB RAM; Quadro 4000...so no CUDA for HQplayer) with Ubuntu Studio 14.04 installed on a Samsung 850 SSD...that was really close...only showing about 18-19% processer...but it still stutters...definitely the closest I've gotten with polysinc-2s.

 

For your case, clock speed is more important than number of cores once you get at least quad-core (or 6-core). Do you have Pipeline SDM enabled?

 

My final assault is to add a MSI GTX970 for CUDA...but if that doesn't do it...I'm going to try to forget about this and be content with DSD256.

 

Should work fine, I was able to run 8 channels @DSD256 to exaSound e28 using GTX980. Do you have the proprietary nVidia drivers installed on your Linux machine? The open source drivers don't support CUDA or many other features. And 14.04 comes with too old proprietary drivers, so you need to download and install latest from nVidia website.

 

On Linux, also set "Buffer time" in HQPlayer to 100 ms to relax the OS latency requirements a bit.

 

I should also mention that I use NAA's for actual playback my IFI...currently a Sonicorbiter SE running HQplayer.

 

Best approach is to first get the playback running locally, and then add NAA once you have things running fine locally. Otherwise you could be chasing a network problem by changing computers which doesn't really help much.

 

Am I missing something? Jussi...I think you mentioned that you had to turn graphics off with your E5 and CUDA card to get there? How do I do that?

 

My Xeon E5 is running DSD512 upsampling just fine with -2s filters and Pipeline SDM. Works with and without CUDA.

 

When the GPU is getting close to maximum loads, then one needs to be careful what to do with graphics simultaneously, because doing something like scrolling Facebook web page on browser or watching YouTube videos puts some load on the GPU too.


Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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Yes, probably won't be able to do DSD512... I think it should do DSD256 just fine with -2s filters.

 

For your case, clock speed is more important than number of cores once you get at least quad-core (or 6-core). Do you have Pipeline SDM enabled?

 

Yes, I have pipeline SDM enabled and I can do DSD256 with -2s filters.

 

Should work fine, I was able to run 8 channels @DSD256 to exaSound e28 using GTX980. Do you have the proprietary nVidia drivers installed on your Linux machine? The open source drivers don't support CUDA or many other features. And 14.04 comes with too old proprietary drivers, so you need to download and install latest from nVidia website.

 

On Linux, also set "Buffer time" in HQPlayer to 100 ms to relax the OS latency requirements a bit.

 

Don't have the GTX970 yet...do to arrive on Wednesday. I know about the proprietary drivers and will be sure to install. Have you tested the ones that just shipped a week ago? Already using 250ms buffer time.

 

I'm having trouble getting the right Linux drivers for the native DSD. I know I need to use the trusty ones...but can you tell me exactly which ones for this system? I'm installing with Gdebi and got some errors on the libasound drivers. These are the ones I tried to install:

 

libasound2_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_i386.deb

libasound2-data_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_all.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-39.66j2_all.deb

linux-tools-3.13.0-48-lowlatency_3.13.0-48.80jil14_i386.deb

 

 

 

Best approach is to first get the playback running locally, and then add NAA once you have things running fine locally. Otherwise you could be chasing a network problem by changing computers which doesn't really help much.

 

Seems reasonable. I'll give that a try. Just need to make sure I have all my DSD drivers correct first.

 

 

My Xeon E5 is running DSD512 upsampling just fine with -2s filters and Pipeline SDM. Works with and without CUDA.

 

When the GPU is getting close to maximum loads, then one needs to be careful what to do with graphics simultaneously, because doing something like scrolling Facebook web page on browser or watching YouTube videos puts some load on the GPU too.

 

If I remember correctly your E5 is clocked higher than mine...though. I do have pipelineSDM checked...and I noticed that HQplayer isn't using all of the 16 cores evenly...some running hot while others not running at all.

 

Thanks for all the help as usual!

 

Robert


Software: Roon/HQplayer; System I: Roon Server/HQplayer DSD 512 Upsampling, Custom Windows 10 PC/AO, LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; Holo Cyan DAC; VPI Scout 2 Turntable, Soundsmith Boheme, TTW Clamps and Carbon Matt; Cary SLP-98P Preamp; Van Alstine FET 600 Poweramp;  Aerial Acoustics 6T loudspeakers, SVS SB13 Ultra Subwoofers. System II: Custom PC with Signalyst Linux HQplayer NAA; LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; IFI Micro iDSD Black Label; Primaluna Dialogue 2 with Tung Sol KT-150; Paradigm Studio 20 v3 monitors on Custom Mapleshade stands. Cables: Moon Audio, LUSH, Kimber Kable, Mapleshade, LARRY custom.

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I'm having trouble getting the right Linux drivers for the native DSD. I know I need to use the trusty ones...but can you tell me exactly which ones for this system? I'm installing with Gdebi and got some errors on the libasound drivers. These are the ones I tried to install:

 

libasound2_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_i386.deb

libasound2-data_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_all.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-39.66j2_all.deb

linux-tools-3.13.0-48-lowlatency_3.13.0-48.80jil14_i386.deb

 

You need 64-bit OS version, and thus you need the "amd64" packages.

 

You need following:

libasound2-data_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_all.deb

libasound2_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_amd64.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-76_3.13.0-76.120jl35_all.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-76-lowlatency_3.13.0-76.120jl35_amd64.deb

linux-image-3.13.0-76-lowlatency_3.13.0-76.120jl35_amd64.deb

 

Notice the 76.120jl35 is the latest kernel. There are fairly frequent kernel updates, so it is good to stay up to date on that front.

 

At some point when I find time I'll try to setup a proper package repository, then you can get updates automatically.

 

If I remember correctly your E5 is clocked higher than mine...though. I do have pipelineSDM checked...and I noticed that HQplayer isn't using all of the 16 cores evenly...some running hot while others not running at all.

 

If you are doing normal stereo playback, depending on filters you get high load on four cores. With closed-form you may get more cores utilized. However, pretty much all cores are utilized when initializing the playback, so having lot of cores helps making playback start faster.


Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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FWIW, I can do both DSD256 and DSD512. And although I ifnd (especially with SABRE-based dacs) that getting to 256 is a HUGE sonic improvement over 64 and even 128, I do not find 512 to be worth the hassle at all. Marginal sq above 256, and I say that just to be safe...I can't really hear it, frankly.

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FWIW, I can do both DSD256 and DSD512. And although I ifnd (especially with SABRE-based dacs) that getting to 256 is a HUGE sonic improvement over 64 and even 128, I do not find 512 to be worth the hassle at all. Marginal sq above 256, and I say that just to be safe...I can't really hear it, frankly.

 

I agree with you. I have a Sabre dac that can do dsd 512 and I am at a loss to hear any significant gain over dsd 256. I keep it set on dsd 256 and never bother with dsd 512. Some other dac's might produce different or better results with dsd 512 but I haven't heard one yet.

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I agree with you. I have a Sabre dac that can do dsd 512 and I am at a loss to hear any significant gain over dsd 256. I keep it set on dsd 256 and never bother with dsd 512. Some other dac's might produce different or better results with dsd 512 but I haven't heard one yet.

 

Thanks guys...very helpful.

 

Robert


Software: Roon/HQplayer; System I: Roon Server/HQplayer DSD 512 Upsampling, Custom Windows 10 PC/AO, LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; Holo Cyan DAC; VPI Scout 2 Turntable, Soundsmith Boheme, TTW Clamps and Carbon Matt; Cary SLP-98P Preamp; Van Alstine FET 600 Poweramp;  Aerial Acoustics 6T loudspeakers, SVS SB13 Ultra Subwoofers. System II: Custom PC with Signalyst Linux HQplayer NAA; LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; IFI Micro iDSD Black Label; Primaluna Dialogue 2 with Tung Sol KT-150; Paradigm Studio 20 v3 monitors on Custom Mapleshade stands. Cables: Moon Audio, LUSH, Kimber Kable, Mapleshade, LARRY custom.

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Thanks. I've got the system working with this involving ROON + HQ Player on a server and dedicated NAA connected to the e18 DAC. My server is an upgraded CAPS Zuma V3 with settings (PCM) being poly-sinc-shrt-mp / NS5 / 384kHz with 96kHz filters generated from Acourate. The current issue is that whilst it's all working I'm hearing crackle / static on occasion. My first thought was that this might be because the server is under-powered but that doesn't seem to be the case as the latency on start-up is only about 5-10sec whilst CPU is running at 25% and Memory at 3.5G of 8G. Any ideas on how to diagnosis the issue would be much appreciated.

 

Weird. I've removed the NAA and am playing direct from HQ Player without Roon but still getting the same crackle / static. This behaviour is occasional and occurs irrespective of the filtering (to test I've tried TPDF down at 96kHz as well as no filtering). My DAC is exaSound e18 and convolution is being done at 96kHz filters. Any suggestions as to the next step to diagnose the issue?

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Weird. I've removed the NAA and am playing direct from HQ Player without Roon but still getting the same crackle / static. This behaviour is occasional and occurs irrespective of the filtering (to test I've tried TPDF down at 96kHz as well as no filtering). My DAC is exaSound e18 and convolution is being done at 96kHz filters. Any suggestions as to the next step to diagnose the issue?

 

Have you tried with no convolution too?

Have you tried with Foobar?

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Weird. I've removed the NAA and am playing direct from HQ Player without Roon but still getting the same crackle / static. This behaviour is occasional and occurs irrespective of the filtering (to test I've tried TPDF down at 96kHz as well as no filtering). My DAC is exaSound e18 and convolution is being done at 96kHz filters. Any suggestions as to the next step to diagnose the issue?

 

With Acourate you can create filters for 192k even if your measurement is 96k or similar and ask it the extend the filter flat above the measurement bandwidth. Then leave the HF Expand option disabled in HQPlayer.

 

Also pay attention to the filter gain, so that if there are boost peaks in the response, those frequencies don't cause overload in HQPlayer. You can use the gain compensation option in HQPlayer to compensate for this as necessary. So in the end, pay attention to the Limited counter in HQPlayer main window to make sure it stays 0 at all times.


Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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You need 64-bit OS version, and thus you need the "amd64" packages.

 

You need following:

libasound2-data_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_all.deb

libasound2_1.0.27.2-3.1jl2_amd64.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-76_3.13.0-76.120jl35_all.deb

linux-headers-3.13.0-76-lowlatency_3.13.0-76.120jl35_amd64.deb

linux-image-3.13.0-76-lowlatency_3.13.0-76.120jl35_amd64.deb

 

Notice the 76.120jl35 is the latest kernel. There are fairly frequent kernel updates, so it is good to stay up to date on that front.

 

Sorry...another Linux newbie question. I'm assuming that I shouldn't update to a new kernal that you don't already have a header or image file for...correct? And is the 3.13.0 reference in the files above suggest that these are for the 3.13.0b3? How important is all of this to match exactly? I'm a mac user and this is a lot to keep track of...but I guess that's the fun!

 

Robert


Software: Roon/HQplayer; System I: Roon Server/HQplayer DSD 512 Upsampling, Custom Windows 10 PC/AO, LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; Holo Cyan DAC; VPI Scout 2 Turntable, Soundsmith Boheme, TTW Clamps and Carbon Matt; Cary SLP-98P Preamp; Van Alstine FET 600 Poweramp;  Aerial Acoustics 6T loudspeakers, SVS SB13 Ultra Subwoofers. System II: Custom PC with Signalyst Linux HQplayer NAA; LPS-1 powered Startech USB card; LPS-1 powered ISO Regen; IFI Micro iDSD Black Label; Primaluna Dialogue 2 with Tung Sol KT-150; Paradigm Studio 20 v3 monitors on Custom Mapleshade stands. Cables: Moon Audio, LUSH, Kimber Kable, Mapleshade, LARRY custom.

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