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New vs. old


phusis

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I've never heard a digital transcription of a vinyl LP that sounds like the original, no matter what level of equipment or how much expertise is put into it.

 

I believe Paul was referring to what are known as "needle drops" - hi res digital files created from vinyl using software such as Channel D's 'Pure Vinyl'. I haven't done any comparisons but, from various reports, they are supposed to sound very close to the original.

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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Not my experience at all.

 

I am talking about what are commonly called "needle drops" - is that the same thing you are talking about?

 

I am totally unable to tell the difference (blind testing) between the LP playing and the "needle drop." Unless of course, I spent some time cleaning up pops and crackles, if there are any.

 

-Paul

 

 

I've never heard a digital transcription of a vinyl LP that sounds like the original, no matter what level of equipment or how much expertise is put into it.

 

I am not trying to imply that digital is worse than vinyl or vice versa. What I am saying, however, is that a digital recording of any analogue source still does not sound like the original analogue source in my experience, whether that be a live instrument or a pre-existing analogue recording. It's not even close. As soon as I hear an instrument live, the shortcomings of every reproduction medium - digital, vinyl, whatever, become immediately obvious.

Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never dealt with a cat DAC.

Robert A. Heinlein

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Yep. :) Also not having to get up and flip sides and being able to easily pause the music adds considerably to my enjoyment. :)

 

-Paul

 

 

I believe Paul was referring to what are known as "needle drops" - hi res digital files created from vinyl using software such as Channel D's 'Pure Vinyl'. I haven't done any comparisons but, from various reports, they are supposed to sound very close to the original.

Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never dealt with a cat DAC.

Robert A. Heinlein

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Bluesman: Ha! That reminds me of a job where the master bath had his and her stools. She demanded hers be replaced when she thought someone (inadvertently?) had used hers. She made it known that even her husband was not allowed to use it. The toilet was replaced-they never did settle properly on their bill however.

Forrest:

Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA

DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP>

Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz

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Bluesman: Ha! That reminds me of a job where the master bath had his and her stools. She demanded hers be replaced when she thought someone (inadvertently?) had used hers. She made it known that even her husband was not allowed to use it. The toilet was replaced-they never did settle properly on their bill however.

 

The toilet was replaced because of the stools!? Isn't that what toilets are for? :)

"Relax, it's only hi-fi. There's never been a hi-fi emergency." - Roy Hall

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." - William Bruce Cameron

 

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I've never heard a digital transcription of a vinyl LP that sounds like the original, no matter what level of equipment or how much expertise is put into it.

 

I am not trying to imply that digital is worse than vinyl or vice versa. What I am saying, however, is that a digital recording of any analogue source still does not sound like the original analogue source in my experience, whether that be a live instrument or a pre-existing analogue recording. It's not even close. As soon as I hear an instrument live, the shortcomings of every reproduction medium - digital, vinyl, whatever, become immediately obvious.

 

Very important observation. This addresses Mr. Weiss' rather inaccurate take on analog being a representation of the Kantian "das ding an sich" (i.e.: the thing itself), as he goes:

 

The only other explanation is the actual means of playback- a needle tracing a groove is ANALOG- it is the thing itself, to get Kantian, not a transliteration. Digital, however hi-res, is always an APPROXIMATION of sound, a sampling of reality every so many tens or hundreds of thousands of times a second.

 

That is, analog is also a "transliteration" and hereby an approximation as well; Kant's 'Das ding an sich' is the "raw" state of the world beyond our perceptive abilities/limitations, and as such always out-of-reach. I guess the most fitting use of Kant here is therefore to ascribe the actual live acoustic performance the attribute of being "the thing itself," insofar we're always trying to approximate it as something other than (by virtue of not being) the live performance itself.

Source: Synology NAS > DIY Mediaserver • Software: JRiver MC31/Fidelizer Pro Optical output: ASUS Xonar AE 24/192 • DAC/preamp: Blue Cheese Audio Roquefort Digital cross-over: Xilica XP-3060 • Speakers: Electro-Voice TS9040D LX (for active config.)  Subwoofers: 2 x MicroWrecker Tapped Horns • EV horns amp: MC² Audio T2000 • EV bass amp: MC² Audio T1500 • Subs amp: MC² Audio T2000 • EV horns cables: Mundorf silver/gold 1mm solid-core • IC: Mundorf silver/gold XLR/Mogami 2549 XLR/Cordial CMK Road 250 XLR • Subs and EV bass cable: Cordial CLS 425 • Power cables: 15AWG Solid-core wire w/IeGo pure copper plugs (DIY)

 

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I could buy new vinyl and rip it. But I decided to get new CDs or downloads of those I really love instead, because they sound better than well worn vinyl and I'm not schlepping even more records to our retirement apartment... I have to choose new over old except for a very few special and rarely played records

 

David,

 

I've just completed a process similar to yours, where I acquired CD's of most of my non-classical vinyl, and used them to add that music to my digital library. Ripping the CD's was much faster then digitizing (needle drop).

 

My justification for not digitizing all those records were:

1) It would be a horrible amount of work

2) Many of my records are well played, a little worn, accumulated dirt in the grooves, etc. even through well care for

3) Most of the recordings are early studio products, that really don't sound that great anyway

 

So now there are now only a couple of dozen (rare and high SQ), out of hundreds of albums, waiting to be digitized. I have gotten rid of the old records replaced in this way, to some small profit, and a big relief for all the pounds lost from the 'stuff' weighing down my life.

 

I am working toward a goal of 100% of my music in the digital library, with a small number of very special vinyl records and a larger number of favorite CD's for 'backup'. Small and light, easy to leave behind if necessary. I could then par down to a MacMini, DAC, Ext HD, and a pair of headphones !!

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I have gotten rid of the old records replaced in this way, to some small profit, and a big relief for all the pounds lost from the 'stuff' weighing down my life.

I'd love to sell much of my collection, but my son wants it all - so I figure I'll just spend the equivalent amount now and take it out of his inheritance (should I be so careless as to leave anything behind besides records and CDs when I depart this lovely globe).

 

It's funny to discuss this with him, too. He's about to turn 33 and is an audio purist well beyond my wildest dreams (or worst nightmares). He has no kids, but he has a 3 bedroom house because he needed a listening room. He's been picking on my digital library for years - but when he discovered a streaming client for his Android, he started listening to my FLACs. The older my son gets, the smarter I seem to get - just ask him.

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