DSD via HDMI

[phatoldsun]

This is probably not the most audiophile question, but I want to try it.

I have an older Marantz SR6003 AV receiver that will process DSD via HDMI 1.3. It works for SACD playback via HDMI with OPPO BDP 95. The DSD LCD indicator comes on. If you're wondering, the OPPO sounds better via analog outs vs. the DAC in the Marantz for SACD.

 

When I try to play a DSD download with MacMini>Audirvana+ Playlist mode>HDMI>SR6003 it doesn't work. A+ shows the track progressing, but I get no sound with DoP or the Initial dCS method. It DOES play 176.2/24 PCM when using the DSD to PCM conversion.

 

How can I get the DSD playback to work via HDMI on OSX 10.9? Will J River do this?

 

Thanks.

[Audio_ELF]

How can I get the DSD playback to work via HDMI on OSX 10.9? Will J River do this?

You can't. (As far as I am aware) there is no interface for a computer which supports DSD out via HDMI.

 

Eloise

[astrallite]

This is why I keep an old Oppo BDP-83. You can burn DVD-R ISOs of DSDs and play them on the player. Only the BDP-83 and BDP-80 support playing burned SACDs.

 

On the downside you hear a lot of "clicking" when playing DVD-Rs on the older gen Oppos, it's quite a noisy player.

[Boris75]

Are there DSD DACs (outside integrated receivers) that have HDMI inputs accepting DSD bitstreams?

[CatManDo]

Not that I know.

 

The only stand-alone DAC with HDMI input is the NAD M51, and it does not accept DSD.

 

It would be great to have such a DAC, and to play SACDs with an Oppo connected to the DAC without having to convert the signal to PCM.

[phatoldsun]

You can't. (As far as I am aware) there is no interface for a computer which supports DSD out via HDMI.

 

Eloise

 

Thanks for the reply. What part is missing? Is the transfer protocol? Like DoP is only for USB? Or the .dsf, .dff container can't be unpacked? Or the MacMini HDMI output doesn't meet the 1.3b spec?

Or maybe more simply what is different between DSD on SACD vs. DSD on a hard drive that prevents the HDMI output?

 

Just curious if anybody knows.

[Miska]

Thanks for the reply. What part is missing? Is the transfer protocol?

 

At least it would need support from the HDMI audio device driver and possibly some level of support from the HDMI interface chip too, so that you could send DSD stream out and that it would be tagged as such in the transfer protocol...

 

IIRC, theoretically HDMI could support DSD frequencies up to 49.152 MHz (DSD1024).

 

Like DoP is only for USB?

 

DoP doesn't depend on the transfer media type, but requires support from both ends. It would work with HDMI too if there would be something at the other end of the HDMI cable that would understand it. It is just DSD made to look like PCM to pass through PCM-only aware layers. DSD over HDMI is a distinct audio content format like PCM, DolbyDigital or DTS.

 

Or the MacMini HDMI output doesn't meet the 1.3b spec?

 

I think it does, but there are lot of features marked "optional".

[maelob]

It seems that multichannel surround playback of DSD files is not a priority for companies. To be honest I love multi channel SACD and I am sure a lot of other people do. Don't know why is such a challenge to come up with a single cable solution to play DSD files over an AVR/preamp. Maybe is a computer hardware issue but hopefully somebody come up with a solution.

[Bill Lord]

Here are some older receivers that accept DSD over HDMI.

 

 

• Sony STR-DA5300ES (named TA-DA5300ES in Japan), STR-DA4400ES, STR-DA5400ES, STR-DA6400ES and STR-DA5500ES
  
• Pioneer VSX-91THX, VSX-92HTX and VSX-94THX
  
• Marantz SR6001, SR7001, SR7002, SR8001, SR8002, AV8003 and SR6004
  
• Yamaha RX-V661, RX-V761, RX-V861, RX-V1700, RX-V2700, RX-V1800, RX-V3800 and RX-Z11 (DSP-AX661, DSP-AX761, DSP-AX861, DSP-AX1700, DSP-AX2700, DSP-AX1800, DSP-AX3800 and DSP-Z11 in some regions)
  
• Onkyo TX-SR705, TX-SR805, TX-SR875 and TX-NR905
  
• Denon AVR-3808, AVR-4308
  

[Audio_ELF]

Here are some older receivers that accept DSD over HDMI.

A very nice list... But it still doesn't alter the fact that (afaik) there is no way to output DSD from a computer via HDMI.

 

Eloise

[mayhem13]

It seems that multichannel surround playback of DSD files is not a priority for companies. To be honest I love multi channel SACD and I am sure a lot of other people do. Don't know why is such a challenge to come up with a single cable solution to play DSD files over an AVR/preamp. Maybe is a computer hardware issue but hopefully somebody come up with a solution.

 

The solution for audio has always been there......HDMI. Audio chose the route of USB instead. I could go on and on explaining why this happened but is simply don't have the energy to ride that merry-go-round. Let's just say it's really a shame.

[wappinghigh]

The problem with this list is not that these receivers "receive" DSD via HDMI.. the problem is they do it via PCM conversion...

 

In any case since that list, the world has moved onto streaming... so HDMI as far as audio is concerned is old news.. so is USB for that matter, but *that*really is is a merry-go-round ride!!!!

[Audio_ELF]

The problem with this list is not that these receivers "receive" DSD via HDMI.. the problem is they do it via PCM conversion...

Well that's one problem - though if you bypass all processing do any of them do direct conversion; its very difficult to find out.

 

The second problem is (as I commented) that given this is a Computer Audio forum, there is no way of getting DSD out of a computer using HDMI.

 

In any case since that list, the world has moved onto streaming... so HDMI as far as audio is concerned is old news.. so is USB for that matter, but *that*really is is a merry-go-round ride!!!!

Apart from the Oppo 103/105, does anything support multi-channel DSD via streaming?

 

Eloise

[wappinghigh]

^ Not to my knowledge, but it's coming surely..

[wappinghigh]

The best Multichannel DSD experience right now via a MAC is USB out to the Exasound e28... using A+(playlist mode)..

 

It's the best ie the cleanest, simplest (and gapless) solution I've found anyway....

 

Yep: the Oppo 103 and 105 will stream them via UpnP , but *not* gaplessly...

[mayhem13]

The problem with this list is not that these receivers "receive" DSD via HDMI.. the problem is they do it via PCM conversion...

 

In any case since that list, the world has moved onto streaming... so HDMI as far as audio is concerned is old news.. so is USB for that matter, but *that*really is is a merry-go-round ride!!!!

 

I agree.....but I would hope you're not suggesting a 'new' interface enter the market? HDMI offers such huge potential particularly with 2.0. It's not going anywhere anytime soon, so why not tap it's resources?

 

Now is the time for mfgrs to do so as 2.0 has been released. Working backwards through USB or developing another audio only interface is just plain silly.