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Article: Lumin Network Music Player Review


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Some of the prices do seem nuts. But especially today in digital, you can put together a complete "audiophile" level system for $1000, including speakers. Of course it won't give you bass at 20hz or fill a large room with realistic sound levels, but the SQ will be there.

 

Above that, it is a question of diminishing audio returns for the dollar and how much each improvement is worth to you.

 

The Lumin is clearly intended for the higher end of the hi-end of the market. It's out of my price range, but that's fine. I'm glad others can afford and enjoy it. I try to get the best stuff I can afford and enjoy it. I daydream about having, say, $750K to use building a dedicated audio room and the "ultimate" :) system, but I don't let the fantasy ruin my enjoyment of what I've got.

 

Look at the new Olive One coming out. It is similar in basic conception (sort of) and will cost a few hundred dollars. Will it sound as good or be as convenient as the Lumin? No, but I'm sure it will be quite good. A product like that will give you most of the performance of the Lumin for a fraction of the cost. The range of options for every wallet is there. Each of us who has limited funds has to decide where to draw the line.

 

Listen to your music, enjoy it, and don't worry about what you can't afford.

 

The fact of the matter is that I can afford it, I just refuse to pay the price. My problem.

mbain

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^well said :)

New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra

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I think to be fair you also need to look at this in a system context. The Lumin is DLNA renderer, so will work fine with minimserver running on a NAS anywhere on your network. You therefore don't need to spend hundreds or even thousands of $ on a C.A.P.S type music server, (at least from the point of view of sound quality), so you can make serious savings on that side of your system.

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mbain, I understand $7200 sounds a lot for a network player. But if you don't have other digital sources, the Lumin can replace your Bryston BDP-1 and ARC DAC 8 which I suspect were similarly priced. So while Lumin is also not a product for me, I can see how someone who is just looking to upgrade their CD player and want to get into computer audio might get the Lumin. I also think as douglas046 pointed out, dealer setup is an important part of the pricing. One of my local dealers really wanted to get into selling more computer audio products. He finds that if he doesn't set it up for his clients, the product return rates are high. But the prices of most lower end products are so low, the profit margin simply does not justify his time to setup the product. Also, most clients do not value the dealer setup because they think they use computers at work so they know how to set up a computer audio system at home. So he ends up primarily selling USB DACs and letting the clients set things up themselves.

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Waiting on Chris to one day review one of these

 

PIONEER ELITE N-30 NETWORKED AUDIO PLAYER $500.00 with Ethernet

Marantz NA-7004 $800.00

Yamaha NP-S2000: $900.00

NAD Masters Series M50: $2,500

Marantz Reference Series NA-11s1 (includes DAC) ; $3,500

The Truth Is Out There

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Fortunately there are cheaper options in this wonderful hobby. I wouldn't look at a Lamborghini and say the auto hobby is nuts and I'm going to start biking :~)

 

By biking do you mean bicycling or motorbiking? If its the quiet, self-propelled biking I suggest a recumbent. You may well find yourself spending more time getting healthy exercise because of the increased comfort and reduction of back, neck strain. Of course there's plenty of bicycle/recumbent geeks with their Garmin's, digital cameras, etc., but every hobby has those merging tech with simple pleasures.

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By biking do you mean bicycling or motorbiking? If its the quiet, self-propelled biking I suggest a recumbent. You may well find yourself spending more time getting healthy exercise because of the increased comfort and reduction of back, neck strain. Of course there's plenty of bicycle/recumbent geeks with their Garmin's, digital cameras, etc., but every hobby has those merging tech with simple pleasures.

 

Shame they didnt call it Linn and give Linn the royalties they deserve

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^ So Linn has patent's on UPnP??? What royalties?.. I thought UPnP/DLNA was an open platform..

New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra

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There is nobody stopping someone paying 7K for a network player (The Linn included) that simply uses an open platform like UPnP.. that is the customers problem..

 

I think Chris makes a very important point in his review. All this UPnP stuff should "just work". Gapless. Right out of the box. Is this worth 7K? Well someone (like me) who doesn't mind tinkering with a 1K Oppo and the like, well no. But to others?.. that is their decision. So long as the product does "just work" of course. So many claim they do.....then don't when the customer get's them home..

New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra

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Never mind. Deleted :)

New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra

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mbain, I understand $7200 sounds a lot for a network player. But if you don't have other digital sources, the Lumin can replace your Bryston BDP-1 and ARC DAC 8 which I suspect were similarly priced. So while Lumin is also not a product for me, I can see how someone who is just looking to upgrade their CD player and want to get into computer audio might get the Lumin. I also think as douglas046 pointed out, dealer setup is an important part of the pricing. One of my local dealers really wanted to get into selling more computer audio products. He finds that if he doesn't set it up for his clients, the product return rates are high. But the prices of most lower end products are so low, the profit margin simply does not justify his time to setup the product. Also, most clients do not value the dealer setup because they think they use computers at work so they know how to set up a computer audio system at home. So he ends up primarily selling USB DACs and letting the clients set things up themselves.

 

The points you raise are well taken. Particularly the the notion of being able to replace the Bryston and DAC 8. However I think the main thrust of my post is being overlooked, most likely my fault. To clarify, let me site and example. Back in the day, my very first stereo consisted of AR4x speakers, a Scott receiver and a Dual turntable. Some time later this system was replaced by Quad ESL speakers and associated Quad electronics. The improvement in sound quality was several quantum leaps and was so easy to appreciate even a caveman could hear it. Since that time I have gone through several iterations of components, never again to notice a quantum leap in sound quality. The successor systems sounded different, yet not necessarily better to the extent of the AR/Quad leap. I suspect that the addition of the Lumin to my present system would result in a sound difference, yet I doubt I would experience a quantum leap improvement in sound quality. In my opinion, a $7200 investment should do just that.

mbain

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^ Agreed. Future improvements in the whole listening experience are indeed coming via a "streaming" format. But I believe this is *not* primarily (as often claimed) because of some magic in engineering. It is coming from an improvement in playback, library storage, software, versatility and the like. The "convenience factors" as I call them.. The factors that pull playback off a disc ..even an LP, and allow you to play the files around the house how and when you want using the convenience of something like an iphone.. The issue as you point out is, are these worth 7K in one particular player?..

New simplified setup: STEREO- Primary listening Area: Cullen Circuits Mod ZP90> Benchmark DAC1>RotelRKB250 Power amp>KEF Q Series. Secondary listening areas: 1/ QNAP 119P II(running MinimServer)>UPnP>Linn Majik DSI>Linn Majik 140's. 2/ (Source awaiting)>Invicta DAC>RotelRKB2100 Power amp>Rega's. Tertiary multiroom areas: Same QNAP>SMB>Sonos>Various. MULTICHANNEL- MacMini>A+(Standalone mode)>Exasound e28 >5.1 analog out>Yamaha Avantage Receiver>Pre-outs>Linn Chakra power amps>Linn Katan front and sides. Linn Trikan Centre. Velodyne SPL1000 Ultra

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I do wonder if any one has tested Lumin vs the Meridian 818 V5, which is pretty good. Yes more expensive and one needs media core also....

Qnap NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > Grimm MU1 > Mola Mola Tambaqui /Meridian 808.3> Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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The points you raise are well taken. Particularly the the notion of being able to replace the Bryston and DAC 8. However I think the main thrust of my post is being overlooked, most likely my fault. To clarify, let me site and example. Back in the day, my very first stereo consisted of AR4x speakers, a Scott receiver and a Dual turntable. Some time later this system was replaced by Quad ESL speakers and associated Quad electronics. The improvement in sound quality was several quantum leaps and was so easy to appreciate even a caveman could hear it. Since that time I have gone through several iterations of components, never again to notice a quantum leap in sound quality. The successor systems sounded different, yet not necessarily better to the extent of the AR/Quad leap. I suspect that the addition of the Lumin to my present system would result in a sound difference, yet I doubt I would experience a quantum leap improvement in sound quality. In my opinion, a $7200 investment should do just that.

 

Well, yes b/c there is a very steep diminishing returns curve with audio. Once you have an "audiophile" level system (even an entry level audiophile system, let's say something that costs $1000-$2000) you generally have to spend an additional thousand or even thousands per component to significantly improve the sound. And those improvements are never going to be as big as going from a consumer or prosumer system to an audiophile one. One of the reasons hi-end equipment is so expensive and one of the reasons for "audiophillia nervosa" is that chase after the last 10%, the last 5%, and the last 1% of the never attained "perfect" sound.

 

If you have a good $1K to $4K system, you may need to spend $5-$10K to feel you've made the next leap. If you have a very good pair of speakers and amp that costs that $10k, you may have to buy a replacement setup for $25-$40K to really feel like you've made a "quantum leap" again. So most of us mortals never make that leap, b/c we can't afford it. Just spending a "little" more doesn't get you there, even if it does get you a little closer.

Main listening (small home office):

Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments.

Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three .

Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup.
Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. 

All absolute statements about audio are false :)

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Well, yes b/c there is a very steep diminishing returns curve with audio. Once you have an "audiophile" level system (even an entry level audiophile system, let's say something that costs $1000-$2000) you generally have to spend an additional thousand or even thousands per component to significantly improve the sound. And those improvements are never going to be as big as going from a consumer or prosumer system to an audiophile one. One of the reasons hi-end equipment is so expensive and one of the reasons for "audiophillia nervosa" is that chase after the last 10%, the last 5%, and the last 1% of the never attained "perfect" sound.

 

If you have a good $1K to $4K system, you may need to spend $5-$10K to feel you've made the next leap. If you have a very good pair of speakers and amp that costs that $10k, you may have to buy a replacement setup for $25-$40K to really feel like you've made a "quantum leap" again. So most of us mortals never make that leap, b/c we can't afford it. Just spending a "little" more doesn't get you there, even if it does get you a little closer.

 

Understood and that is precisely the problem with "high end" today...in my opinion.

mbain

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Understood and that is precisely the problem with "high end" today...in my opinion.

 

While I agree with you about the price (yet I understand the arguments that call it a value for the ease of use, built in DAC, linear power, etc), I think the inverse of you comment is wonderful news:

 

The state of "high end" is that it takes a LOT of money to best very affordable and outstanding sounding systems. This is the wonderful part of your comment....music for the masses that is of tremendous quality.

 

Best,

John

Positive emotions enhance our musical experiences.

 

Synology DS213+ NAS -> Auralic Vega w/Linear Power Supply -> Auralic Vega DAC (Symposium Jr rollerball isolation) -> XLR -> Auralic Taurus Pre -> XLR -> Pass Labs XA-30.5 power amplifier (on 4" maple and 4 Stillpoints) -> Hawthorne Audio Reference K2 Speakers in MTM configuration (Symposium Jr HD rollerball isolation) and Hawthorne Audio Bass Augmentation Baffles (Symposium Jr rollerball isolation) -> Bi-amped w/ two Rythmic OB plate amps) -> Extensive Room Treatments (x2 SRL Acoustics Prime 37 diffusion plus key absorption and extensive bass trapping) and Pi Audio Uberbuss' for the front end and amplification

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Great review of the problems of network streaming players.

 

As a reformed Linn DS user, you speak the truth. When things work, it is a great system. Things can get pretty frustrating, however.I remember why I keep a turntable around. It always works.

 

Jeez, I must be in a real minority since I've never had any problems with network streaming players...I've been using Sonos since 2006 or so and it has worked fine for years, the PS Audio PWD worked with no hiccups (didn't do gapless, but that is a design flaw which PSA should have been upfront about, not a network issue), and I have never had one problem with either of my two Linn DS players - ADS/0 which I sold and now my KDS/1.

 

Sure, there are folks on the Linn forums that can't figure out their network for some reason, but don't blame it on the DS -- if it gets the bits, it plays the hits!

ChrisG

Bend, OR

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^ So Linn has patent's on UPnP??? What royalties?.. I thought UPnP/DLNA was an open platform..

 

I think he is referring to how this is a Klimax DS clone in a lot of ways...doesn't sound as good, but it don't cost as much either!

ChrisG

Bend, OR

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I think he is referring to how this is a Klimax DS clone in a lot of ways...doesn't sound as good, but it don't cost as much either!
.....just my 2-cents on the subject player...i have had mine for about 4-5 months. it replaced a PS Audio PWD MKII. to my ears..it is everything and more that is detailed in the review. it couldn't be more user friendly. i use 'MinimServer' through my imac and use 'Kinsky' as my ipad app to controll it. i have had no gliches with it and sonically it is superb.the '$7200' is a relative price. i was fortunate to buy it at a price less than the $7200 currently being quoted but given its

superb design and workmanship and its great sound and the fact that it does 'DSD' makes it a no brainer even at its current price.Thanks for the great review of a truly great product..

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From more research I have recently learned that the Lumin, even at its current factory MSRP or retail price definitively outperforms the Chord, the Weiss, dCS and even Esoteric. 6moons mentioned hands down that it blows away the famous $12K-$13K Esoteric K-03. That means the Lumin is a good value and an outstanding engineering achievement even at $7K.

 

I follow the rule "if you don't listen you don't have an opinion"...

Your "research" means nothing...imho.

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if it gets the bits, it plays the hits!

The network configuration is an upfront "cost", but once done right it plays well forever.

very happy user of a linn ds here.

 

Linn is frequently listening for it's users and actively upgrading firmware frequently...and very easily done.

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