exaSound e18 - e20 - e28 - Info and Experiences Post All Here

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I thought it would be good for people that own or are interested in the exaSound DACs to have central place to post info and their experiences of the exaSound DACs.

 

 

To start things off here is an update from exaSound.

 

exaSound is offering an upgraded clock on the e20 MK III as a "Custom order". The clock upgrade is from .13ps rms to .082ps rms and is a $100 price increase over the e20 MK III ($2,899 to $2,999 CAD). The clock must be ordered at time of purchase of the DAC.

The price of the upgraded clock might increase in the near future so anyone who has an interest should not wait. It is likely to go up.

 

The clocks from MSB are as follows, .14 and .077 while the exaSound clocks are .13 and .082 and the difference between the two best is just .005. I think this says a lot about the e20 MK III.

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Hi soundrebels.

 

Pardon, but not sure what you mean by the above post. I just would like to understand your meaning.

 

But thank you for the link on your review of the e28. I know of several people here in the USA that are interested in that version.

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Christopher, I am also getting an exaSound e20 MKIII with the new custom clock option (.082 ps rms). I am not sure when mine will arrive yet. I hope end of this week but do not expect it will be that soon. Otherwise sometime next week. Then it is back to burn-in all over again. Though the e20 sounds great right out of the box.

 

I played a few tracks that I use for demos over and over so I can try and remember, as best I can, little nuances in the sound of the songs.

I will play the same tracks back once to see if there are any noticeable improvements after the clock upgrade.

 

NOW before anyone beats me up with how we can not remember the details of the sound after just a few seconds, move on please.

I will debate it another time. (though I agree to a point)

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Well, I hope to have the e20 MK III with .082ps optional clock end of today.

 

As soon as I have a chance to do demo I will report what I hear. I will give my first impressions and then let the e20 settle in for a few days and report back.

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TO ALL.

 

I am looking for anyone who is using ANY type OR brand outboard power supply with the exaSound DAC and what results they got compared to the stock power supply.

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Christopher, if possible can you try the e20 with and without your iFi USB Power and report any difference? It is my understanding that the e20 should not benefit from something like this. Its USB power is isolated.

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To all.

 

As far as an external power supply for the exaSound. I appreciate the suggestions. I am aware of the Teddy P, etc.

 

So far I have come across the following, in no particular order:

 

1) Paul Hynes

 

2) Teddy Pardo

 

3) Red Wine Audio (Battery Power)

 

4) Mojo Audio

 

5) Core Audio Technology

 

6) KECES

 

7) Custom HiFi Cables

 

8) Mains Cables R Us

 

9) ??? I am sure there are more.

 

Has anyone tried any from this list (on your DAC or PC/Mac) and what are your thoughts?

 

Please fell free to add to the list.

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Roch, thanks.

 

When you get the Paul Hynes I will be very interested in your feedback. When I get an external PS I would like to get the most bang for the buck. My understanding is that Paul builds the best. But between the long wait and the cost I am also checking for alternatives.

 

Yea, to me the USB mini adapters with a high end USB cable makes no sense. It needs to be a all in one design if there is to be any benefit at all.

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Oh, I meant to add that my e20 MKIII with .082rms clock has finally arrived but my Mac Mini is out for an adjustment in its OS with remote desk top for headless capability. I run both Mac and W8 in boot camp in a headless config. I use my iPad wireless as my monitor. So I need to be able to go from one OS to the other using only the iPad. And I need to be able to do this whether from my system or others.

 

Right now we can get it to do it with my system. We hope to be able to get it to work were ever I bring the DAC and Mini to.

 

I hope to have it back in a day or two and then a few days of listening before I report on the .082 clock.

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hardfour, thanks for the report. You may want to put a 100 or 200 hours on the power supply to get the best out of it. Though I am not sure how much of an improvement will happen there should be some. Please report back as you have more of a chance to hear and more time on the power supply.

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Thanks for the update Christopher on the iFi iUSB Power Supply. You and Roch saved me some money and wasted time.

 

hardfour, have you had a chance to listen to the Teddy Pardo Power Supply in more detail yet?

 

Regards, Al.

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Well I have about 150 hours on my e20 MKIII .082 Clock DAC. The first question is does the Clock upgrade make a positive difference. The second question is, if it makes a positive difference, is it enough to do the upgrade.

 

To answer the first. YES, it makes a positive difference. The DAC is even more quiet, has more micro and even macro dynamics coming through. You can hear more room/hall ambiance. The body acoustics of the instruments are heard to a greater extent, to the point were the instruments and the performance is more live sounding. So the music sounds more musical.

This is across the frequency spectrum. The sound is very detailed and resolving but never harsh, smooth in a way at the same time.

This is not an OMG type of difference as the standard e20 is that good but it is easily heard. Actually you will say OMG because the tone of the instruments and voices are amazing.

 

The answer to second question is a BIG YES!! At the current price of the Clock upgrade it is a no brainer.

 

Do not walk, run, as at this price it is a bargain. Actually George should just make it a standard part of the MKIII.

 

But yet I expect more to come because I am still using the included wall wart. Many others have reported how much better sounding the e20 is with a very good external power supply. And I can sense that my e20 is being held back. Like a champion race horse held back, just waiting to be unleashed.

 

Now I must get an external power supply, not because the e20 has to have it to sound great because it already does, but because I need to know just how much can it.

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Hi zdonne. Congratulations on the e20 MK III. Well the burn in is taking a little longer then I expected do to other obligations.

 

Having sad that it is sounding wonderful and more so every week. I have a Paul Hynes power supply coming in a few weeks and once that is burned in I will post my impressions.

 

I will try and post more in a day or two.

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Well, my Paul Hynes SR3-12 Power Supply is shipped and on its way. Unfortunately it "has been received at our international mail centre and is being made ready for despatch overseas" since Friday. I am hoping it gets here by Friday the latest. Wed would be nicer. Once I do have it I will put on at least 50+ hours before I give my initial impressions. Then another 50+ and then 100+ for a total of over 200+ hours for a final evaluation.

 

Paul stated that his SR5-12 would give even better results but that was out of my price range at the moment. He did say that the SR3-12 is a great match for the e20 with great results, just that the SR5-12 will give that last bit of performance.

 

More to come.

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Stew, I spoke to George about that a month ago and he does not expect it to be to market for about six months at that time. I have heard from other sources that it might retail for around $1,000. I hope not.

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Well, the Paul Hynes SR3-12 landed on my doorstep on Friday. It has been up and running since 1:30PM Fri. I have about 70+ hours on it.

 

When first powered up the system with the new power supply hooked up, the sound stage became restricted. Some instruments got small, so to speak. However there were some parts that sounded better. After about two hours it started to slowly open up. Over the course of several days the sound went from better to two steps back. In the last day it is settling down. The sound-stage is really opening up with the instruments better placed and more space between them. The tone of the instruments have more body and are more lifelike. Besides the base and midrange having more body and impact the highs have also benefited. The highs have a more natural sound to them, like the shimmer on the cymbals and more air to them.

 

Now do not misunderstand me, the e20 MK III is a great sounding DAC without the upgraded power supply, just more so now.

 

As the SR3-12 does not come with a power cord I first used a heavy duty "give away" but then after about 30 hours I replaced it with a Triode Wire Labs power cable. After several hours it settled down and helped bring further improvements, small but worthwhile.

 

From my experience, beyond this, being able to add a better power supply will almost guarantee better sound performance.

 

Well more to come but I would say it is MORE then a worthwhile improvement if this is the best it gets.

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The only "bad" news is that the Hynes cSr3-12 ontinues to change/settle and ultimately improve through about 400 hours.

 

Holy Cow!! But then again, I have all that improvement in sound to look foreword too. I am glad to hear that there is more to come in improvement in the sound from adding the SR3-12 power supply.

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KingCrimson, I had my exaSound e20 MK III upgraded to the .082 Clock after it was in my system for a couple of months. It was not subtle. Not only was there more of a blacker background but there was better timing, air, and better timber. Do not get me wrong, the standard e20 was no slouch.

 

Also, the exaSound does benefit to an upgraded outboard power supply. I use a Paul Hynes. It took many hours of burn to reach its full potential but it was worth the wait.

 

PM me as I might be selling. I might be going UP in the food chain. But only if the difference if BIG enough as my exaSound has beat or equaled DACs costing at least twice as much.

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are not particularly meaningful in terms of sound quality.

 

It is the Phase noise at <10Hz that matters and 'femto' clocks are not femto at these frequencies, although they are better than standard clock oscillators. The power supply to the clock is a critical factor and must be very stable and low noise.

 

A typical Crystek or Abracon low phase noise clock costs less than $30 and some can be bought for $24. There is no reason for a manufacturer to offer it as an option, if SQ is what they are aiming for. I also reckon that frequency

stability ie temperature coefficient is important and most clocks are only 50 ppm.

 

If I can find one, I shall try heated clocks (OCXOs) with ppb stability.

 

 

Hi Frank. I agree there is more to it then just the one number and that all of what you stated is just as important or more so depending on the design.

 

I have learned a lot since the original post and will continue to learn.

 

Thanks for bringing this up as I have been meaning to for a while. But you you have described much better then I would be able to.

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There are four updated step-by-step guides on the exaSound website - exaSound Audio Design > Blog > Guides.

 

We are showing the recommended settings for native DSD playback for Audirvana Plus, JRiver for Mac and JRiver for Windows with the exaSound volume integration plug-in. Two new guides are coming soon - HQ Player and Decibel with ASIO on Mac. Let us know if you have any questions or suggestions.

 

Thank you George. As usually you provide first rate support. You are always ahead of most of your competitors, both in the technical side and now by providing us the means to get the best possible sound and enjoyment out of your great sounding DACs. As much as I love the sound of my exaSound, using it with the ASIO driver you have provided as an option has taken it up to another level, IMHO.

Now, having the Guides for all of the above Server Software justs adds icing to the cake.

 

Queries, as much as I like using Audirvana Plus and JRiver with my exaSound e20 MK III .082 Clock, is there an ETA for HQ Player? Best approximate would due.

 

Thanks again and looking foreword the the HQ Player Guide.

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Hi All.

 

Having read how amazing Windows Server 2012 + AO is for audio, and all the comments of how it virtually turns digital into analog, I had to try it for myself. I'll admit I had zero expectations that it would help, given that the exasound dac already mitigates any timing errors the computer may introduce. In theory there is nothing to be gained, but I had to know for myself due to all the overwhelming glowing reviews.

 

I was right.

 

I purchased a Gigabyte broadwell NUC, disabled the fan, installed Windows 8 + Jriver configured identically to my other ATOM setup with the same software. No difference in sound.

 

Next, installed trial server 2012. No difference.

 

Next installed AO. No difference, until I added the "sound signature" and "digital filter modes". These settings sounded like a plugin was being applied across the stereo bus. The sound became slightly veiled, compressed, and transients were rounded. I'm not sure how this could possibly be considered bit-perfect, or an improvement, but perhaps it has a more positive affect on a synchronous USB DAC. That, or it does alter the sound, in a way that others find pleasing.

 

I'm sorry, but I've read some pretty ridiculous things on this thread and feel the need to call them out and provide objective information for anyone else that may find my conclusions useful. Most of the information here is really good, but when I read things like a $500 USB cable, operating system of choice, or even something as crazy as changing the Network card (really?!) "improves" the sound of an asynchronous DAC, like the Ex, I say buyer beware, unless you like buying snake oil.

 

 

Also if anyone wants to send me one of those $500 USB cables, I'll gladly test it objectively as well

 

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BTW my setup is E20 into Linkwitz ASP with DN Subjective Neutrality mod direct into ATI 1506 into Linkwitz Orion 4's. If there are any differences to be heard, my system would resolve it.

 

Here we go again. A USB cable is a USB cable and can not make any difference.

 

Well in most cases that may be true. BUT NOT IN ALL CASES. I have heard a few that have made an easy to hear and a positive improvement. And so did others I know that felt the same way as you.

 

Also why not just try it your self. Many have a home trial money back. My TotalDAC USB cable is one of them, as are others.

 

My TotalDAC cable changed the minds of two audio buddies.They felt the same as you until they heard it in their own systems. Now they own their own TotalDAC USB Cable.

 

Now I would recommend that you try more then one because you might like one over another.

Besides the TotalDAC; Light Harmonic dual end, Audioquest Diamond, Synergistic Research, J Play and CAD are ones that come to mind. I know at least some of them have a money back home trial.

 

If you try the TotalDAC let it run in your system for a few hours before any critical listening.

 

Oh, and one more thing. I never buy snack oil. I work too hard for my money.

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GENTLEMEN, PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC OF THREAD. Thank you.

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From my experience with not only my exaSound but also a friends, in many different systems and many different interconnects, we always found XLR to sound better then SE. But YMMV.

 

 

Here's something interesting.

 

As an exercise I just connected up an old 30' mic cable from the old studio since both the DAC and the Orion Analog Signal Processor support balanced. This is something I meant to do early on but forgot about.

 

Surprisingly the 30' balanced XLR cable is massively clearer, dynamic, and has more solid bass than the 4' Blue Jeans interconnect. Even ignoring the 4V vs 2V output difference, its quite apparent.

 

I'm going to pick up a pair of 6' Mogami Golds which is considered the best cable made in pro audio circles to compare to see if its cable, or balanced (or some combination) that yields the difference

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Sorry but you are mistaken. The e20 MK III, e28 MK I and MK II and the e22 MK I and MK II have no such switch and its Galvanic Isolation is built in. Actually the e20 MK II or MK I had no such switch.

 

Also I (and others I know) have heard the benefits of the TotalDAC USB Cable and some of the other USB cables I mentioned to you in the above post in other systems with other DACs.

 

Such as a Meitner MA-1 DAC, which is one of the best designed Galvanic Isolated USB DACs.

 

 

Did you disable your Exasound DAC Galvanic isolation by any chance? (switch in the back). The noise floor tests from exasound indicate there is no trace of any computer noise going into the DAC with it enabled. (see exaSound Audio Design > e22 > e22 Measurements).

 

The sound is being played from a buffer on the DAC, and the cable just fills that buffer. I'm curious how a USB cable would produce a sonic improvement for this application under normal circumstances (e.g. you dont have a pirate radio transmitter or RADAR in your livingroom..)

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Hmmm, very difficult question to answer. In general these different cables "color" the sound in their own way. The TotalDAC D1 has a somewhat sharper color which works well with a laid back speaker. TQBD is smoother than the TDD1 and works well with a brighter speaker. The Corning is very neutral. To make it even more fun we have the Corning plugged into the PC and then a conventional USB cable between Corning and the DAC.

 

A further dimension to this excercise is the choice of SDM modulator in HQ Player as that affects to some extent the USB cable choices which work for the sound that our ears like.

 

I discovered this past weekend that 30 year old ears have very different preferences to mine when it comes to SDM modulators.

 

Needless to say, I am looking forward to trying out the Regen as the last USB stop before the DAC

 

Ed, why do you have a conventional USB cable plugged into the Corning and the DAC? Does it sound better then just the Corning?

 

Also, while I can not speak about the TQBD USB cable I, and a few others, have to disagree about your assessment of the "color" of the TDD1 USB cable. I, we, have heard it in a VERY revealing, resolving and neutral system and none of us found it "sharp" in any way. Though I do hear that the TQBD is exceptional.

 

As you said in another post it all depends on each of our ears, and personal taste.