HQPlayer's Network Audio Adapter

[tboooe]

This is the device I am waiting to be released: https://www.solid-run.com/product/clearfog-base/

 

Interesting, especially with the SFP! I had my eye on the Up Board Up Board | Power Up Your Ideas! - Specifications.

[juliocat]

Try sudo shutdown -h now

 

Thanks but i can't even log in, it's disabled.

[Jud]

This is the device I am waiting to be released: https://www.solid-run.com/product/clearfog-base/

 

Could consider replacing on board switching chip with 3v3 and 1v8 linear, as well as upgraded caps but has that built in SFP module for a very attractive price.

 

 

Room treatments for headphone users

 

Interesting, especially with the SFP!

 

I'm seeing that the SoM on the ClearFog is supported by Linux kernel versions 3.x, but Stretch (required by Miska's networkaudiod for Debian) uses 4.5 and 4.6 kernel versions. So unless (1) the ClearFog is updated to work with 4.x kernel versions, or (2) Miska makes an image for the ClearFog, it wouldn't immediately be suitable as an NAA. I'm sure it would work for lots of other fun stuff, though.

[semente]

Thanks but i can't even log in, it's disabled.

Sorry, I forgot about that as I'm not using Miska's image.

[ted_b]

Jud,

To answer the only question to Jabbr that I am capable of answering, an FMC (fiber to copper) cost about $25 and then replace the wall wart with something cleaner (I use Anker battery).

https://www.amazon.com/MC220L-Converter-1000Mbps-supporting-mountable/dp/B003CFATL0/ref=sr_1_1?srs=2530652011&ie=UTF8&qid=1471012163&sr=8-1&keywords=mc220l

[tboooe]

I'm seeing that the SoM on the ClearFog is supported by Linux kernel versions 3.x, but Stretch (required by Miska's networkaudiod for Debian) uses 4.5 and 4.6 kernel versions. So unless (1) the ClearFog is updated to work with 4.x kernel versions, or (2) Miska makes an image for the ClearFog, it wouldn't immediately be suitable as an NAA. I'm sure it would work for lots of other fun stuff, though.

I am wondering if I could run Win10 on this? My intention would be to run Win10, Audiophile Optimizer, and Fidelizer as well as the windows version of NAA. I am running Win10 + NAA on an old Atom d525 machine and I love the sound. But this machine has a fan and struggles a bit running Win10. I am looking at a i3-5005u based pc to run the NAA but I may need to also consider the Clearfog now.

[Jud]

Jud,

To answer the only question to Jabbr that I am capable of answering, an FMC (fiber to copper) cost about $25 and then replace the wall wart with something cleaner (I use Anker battery).

https://www.amazon.com/MC220L-Converter-1000Mbps-supporting-mountable/dp/B003CFATL0/ref=sr_1_1?srs=2530652011&ie=UTF8&qid=1471012163&sr=8-1&keywords=mc220l

 

I'd also want an optical Ethernet cable then, right?

[ted_b]

I'd also want an optical Ethernet cable then, right?

 

Yes, they are cheap.

LC/LC Multimode OM3 Fiber Patch Cable

 

You'll also need a couple SFPs, as the board looks to simply have the SFP receptacle (like the FMC).

Genuine Cisco SFP 10g SR Transceiver Module | eBay

 

Or jump in with both feet and get a fiber switch

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/8-9-ports-Gigabit-Ethernet-Optical-Fiber-Switch-with-eight-SFP-ports/32289862298.html

[Jud]

Yes, they are cheap.

LC/LC Multimode OM3 Fiber Patch Cable

 

You'll also need a couple SFPs, as the board looks to simply have the SFP receptacle (like the FMC).

Genuine Cisco SFP 10g SR Transceiver Module | eBay

 

Sorry to get down in the weeds (can't help myself): Any reputed advantage to single mode?

[ted_b]

Sorry to get down in the weeds (can't help myself): Any reputed advantage to single mode?

 

Not sure in our simple audio application, but theoretically single mode has higher transmission rates, longer runs possible (50x) and can be more expensive (but I haven't seen it). But since you are down in the weeds, vape one and the sq will be better with either mode.

 

BTW, I linked to the "wrong" switch that most people use. This is it, and way cheaper (mine is this switch but rebranded by Diablo)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/262037355221?ul_noapp=true&autorefresh=true

[tboooe]

Note sure if this matters in practice but here is a nice definition of multimode:

 

Multimode fiber optic cable has a large diametral core that allows multiple modes of light to propagate. Because of this, the number of light reflections created as the light passes through the core increases, creating the ability for more data to pass through at a given time. Because of the high dispersion and attenuation rate with this type of fiber, the quality of the signal is reduced over long distances. This application is typically used for short distance, data and audio/video applications in LANs. RF broadband signals, such as what cable companies commonly use, cannot be transmitted over multimode fiber.

[Jud]

Note sure if this matters in practice but here is a nice definition of multimode:

 

Multimode fiber optic cable has a large diametral core that allows multiple modes of light to propagate. Because of this, the number of light reflections created as the light passes through the core increases, creating the ability for more data to pass through at a given time. Because of the high dispersion and attenuation rate with this type of fiber, the quality of the signal is reduced over long distances. This application is typically used for short distance, data and audio/video applications in LANs. RF broadband signals, such as what cable companies commonly use, cannot be transmitted over multimode fiber.

 

Apparently multimode will not work reliably with 10G Ethernet when that comes in, so if not wanting to re-buy equipment to work with those computers, single mode would be the "future proof" purchase.

[jabbr]

Pretty amazing it has an SSD on board for that price. Couple of questions I'm curious about:

 

- Wonder if the opto-electronic conversion of the SFP could be a noise source. (Guess I'd use regular Ethernet, then.)

 

- Wonder what the availability of Linux distros would be for this (i.e., how soon could I install Debian Stretch and make an NAA out of it? ).

 

- What components would be needed to connect the SFP to a copper Ethernet router, and how much would they cost?

 

Opto-electric like any circuit depends on parts. The SFP modules generally have very good optics, far far better than TOSLINK . Single mode optics are the best. Both tend to be lower noise than copper Ethernet.

 

Looks like there is a Debian distro for the Armada 38x ... I plan on using that and loading NAA ... The base Clearfog has been announced for awhile and Ive been waitin in production ... I was hoping it would do direct I2S/DSD output on I/O lines but alas...

 

You could get a copper SFP module and connect... or a fiber module and connect via a FMC...

[jabbr]

Apparently multimode will not work reliably with 10G Ethernet when that comes in, so if not wanting to re-buy equipment to work with those computers, single mode would be the "future proof" purchase.

 

No, multimode works great with 10gbe perhaps you mean >100g? Single mode is amazing at these really high speeds... there is a reason why the single mode optics are more expensive though...

[jabbr]

Not sure in our simple audio application, but theoretically single mode has higher transmission rates, longer runs possible (50x) and can be more expensive (but I haven't seen it). But since you are down in the weeds, vape one and the sq will be better with either mode.

 

[emoji41]

[Jud]

Looks like there is a Debian distro for the Armada 38x ... I plan on using that and loading NAA ...

 

I could well be wrong, but it didn't look to me like the Debian distro for the Armada (kernel version 3.x) would be compatible with Debian Stretch (kernel version 4.6), which Miska's network audio daemon requires.

[jabbr]

I could well be wrong, but it didn't look to me like the Debian distro for the Armada (kernel version 3.x) would be compatible with Debian Stretch (kernel version 4.6), which Miska's network audio daemon requires.

 

Too bad, there's also an Archlinux distro and might need to build in necessary support

[Miska]

- Wonder if the opto-electronic conversion of the SFP could be a noise source. (Guess I'd use regular Ethernet, then.)

 

I don't think it is at least any worse than standard Ethernet. And you get full optical isolation.

 

For copper Ethernet links to critical places I configure ports to use 802.3az to lower the used transmit power.

 

- What components would be needed to connect the SFP to a copper Ethernet router, and how much would they cost?

 

Best is to use a switch with SFP ports. This allows you to pick a transceiver module best suited for your use case and cabling.

 

My 24-port HP smart switch has two SFP ports.

[Carl Mawer]

Try pressing the Tab key to see if anything is highlighted, or Enter to see if that works to accept.

 

Thanks Jud. That worked.

Tab highlighted OK and return allowed installation to finish.

Happily listening to HQPlayer with Nanopi Neo NAA.

 

Regards

Carl

[Jud]

I don't think it is at least any worse than standard Ethernet. And you get full optical isolation.

 

For copper Ethernet links to critical places I configure ports to use 802.3az to lower the used transmit power.

 

 

 

Best is to use a switch with SFP ports. This allows you to pick a transceiver module best suited for your use case and cabling.

 

My 24-port HP smart switch has two SFP ports.

 

Thanks Miska, very good information.

 

It turns out the BeagleBoard xM I pulled out of a closet is putting out much less noise than the BBGW. There is a trace of noise left; I am hoping an adapter that lets me run the BBXM from a battery and a network isolator I have coming in the next week will get rid of this last trace. If not, well, there's the Cubox.

[Miska]

It turns out the BeagleBoard xM I pulled out of a closet is putting out much less noise than the BBGW. There is a trace of noise left; I am hoping an adapter that lets me run the BBXM from a battery and a network isolator I have coming in the next week will get rid of this last trace. If not, well, there's the Cubox.

 

What kind of DAC are you using? I've been using BB White/Black and xM without any problems...

[Jud]

What kind of DAC are you using? I've been using BB White/Black and xM without any problems...

 

Hi Miska - iFi micro-iDSD. I don't think this is the problem. My guess is the remaining noise is ground noise. Today I received the network isolator and put it into the downstairs system, not using the NAA, and my wife immediately said "I don't know what you did, but it sounds really good." (And it does. )

 

I want to wait until the adapter comes and I can run the BBXM from a battery before trying it again. I'm fairly sure that will clear it up.

[Miska]

Hi Miska - iFi micro-iDSD. I don't think this is the problem. My guess is the remaining noise is ground noise. Today I received the network isolator and put it into the downstairs system, not using the NAA, and my wife immediately said "I don't know what you did, but it sounds really good." (And it does. )

 

I don't know how you could have ground noise with ethernet, unless you are using shielded cable. Because all the signals go through transformers. That's one of the key points with NAA.

 

For ethernet, the transformer isolation is necessary because otherwise grounding and related noise in large office buildings would become nightmare and real danger for the equipment (think about kilometers of CAT5/CAT6 cabling around the building).

 

But you could look for alternate routes from the other end. Is there a ground link from the PSU - BBB - USB - DAC - audio gear? Are there one or more mains connections with earth pin?

 

One problematic example case from past:

- computer has 3-pin mains connection

- DAC is not isolated so ground goes through

- audio system is floating, so all mains connections are 2-pin

- TV is connected to the audio system through HDMI

- Cable-TV coaxial cable has earth connection through the shield (TV internally connects this to a common ground that also goes to the HDMI connector)

Now the link was ready and lot of hum/noise. Problem was solved by putting a ground-breaker to the cable-TV coaxial cable... Cost - 10€.

[Jud]

I don't know how you could have ground noise with ethernet, unless you are using shielded cable. Because all the signals go through transformers. That's one of the key points with NAA.

 

For ethernet, the transformer isolation is necessary because otherwise grounding and related noise in large office buildings would become nightmare and real danger for the equipment (think about kilometers of CAT5/CAT6 cabling around the building).

 

But you could look for alternate routes from the other end. Is there a ground link from the PSU - BBB - USB - DAC - audio gear? Are there one or more mains connections with earth pin?

 

One problematic example case from past:

- computer has 3-pin mains connection

- DAC is not isolated so ground goes through

- audio system is floating, so all mains connections are 2-pin

- TV is connected to the audio system through HDMI

- Cable-TV coaxial cable has earth connection through the shield (TV internally connects this to a common ground that also goes to the HDMI connector)

Now the link was ready and lot of hum/noise. Problem was solved by putting a ground-breaker to the cable-TV coaxial cable... Cost - 10€.

 

I am supposing the ground noise with the NAA is from the PSU, which is why I'm waiting for the adapter that will allow me to use the battery.

[tboooe]

Hey guys...need some help. For some reason HQP will not play music through my NAA anymore. It worked fine last night but now when I try to play music I see the "Please wait" box flash on and off constantly in HQP. I checked settings and the NAA is recognized. I havent changed anything or upgraded any software recently. When I connect the pc running HQP directly to the DAC via usb it works fine.

 

When i check the networkaudiod window on my win10 machine I see the error "start failure: clASIOMiniEngine::StartAudioClient(): ASIOCreateBuffers()"