AudioQuest DragonFly 24/96 Asynchronous USB DAC / Headphone Amp

[roscoeiii]

Hi Roscoeii -

 

 

P.S. Neat handle. Does it mean anything in particular? Not a mainframer are you?

 

Thanks Paul. Very helpful. I have had the HRT II+ and Pro in the past so this is an excellent frame of reference. Not surprised about the rolloff you mention. IME, it usually takes a pretty robust power supply to really excel at the extremes.

 

As for my handle I am Roscoe The Third (thus roscoeiii, not roscoeii which you wrote; roscoeii is my father). Pretty simple. And no, my son will not be the Fourth. As for the name Roscoe, these days it seems to be more popular for dogs than people. But as a dog lover, I am OK with that.

[wgscott]

Ooohhh. Don't break family tradition. Bad juju.

 

(My kid is William #4).

[AudioDoctor]

I have a bunch of them. I'll send you one if you want.

 

I use them to twiddle molecules around in molecular graphics display programs.

 

how long is that offer good for? I am in the middle of moving at the moment and everything is in chaos here. The boxes have taken over and mail seems to be a bit wonky at the moment.

[wgscott]

Just email me when you are ready.

[firedog]

WG-

 

Is that volume device you use good quality in audio terms, i.e., "transparent"?

 

I understand that connected by USB it will become the master volume for the computer, so I could use it as a master volume for output to a USB DAC over an additional USB port on the computer?

 

Thanks

[Wavelength]

Chris,

 

I am still not getting any notifications.

 

Answers...

 

Development on this was done over about 8 to 10 months. Kind of a funny story... I said lets do this and AQ wanted a dac with minimum phase filters. So we made a couple of dacs with the Wolfson 8741 and cap coupled and direct coupled and differential and single ended and if you don't know this every example costs about $10K to do. So we made up five different samples and they all were evaluated by the team and we were getting closer. I said look let me make what I originally suggested and I will pay for it if you don't like it. Well that is what is shipping! There are 107 components on a 0.6"x1.7" four layer board including a ton of regulators and expensive custom capacitors.

 

3.5mm Do understand that at AudioQuest it's all about the metal. Both the USB connector and the 3.5mm connector are custom one off pieces made with high audio grade silver contacts. If we would have put RCA connectors on these it would have been on wire and what kind of an upgrade path would that have had? nothing!!!!! If we would have put RCA connectors on the unit then it would have been bigger you have to put them at least 0.75" apart and nothing would have fit the model AudioQeust wanted.

 

I did a ton of work on the output stage to make it compatible with both line and headphone. I think it works really well with both as it has more drive than required for line and easily 2x more drive for headphones.

 

Flavors...

 

Look there are a lot of flavors of dacs out there. Everyone seems to be an expert but none of you have listened to all of them so really keep your mouth or fingers off the keyboard. None of us listen the same way or for the same purpose. It's like guitars... you don't hear musicians calling foul on guitars they just don't buy them. Audiophiles should be more like that and really go out an listen before you purchase or make comments.

 

Thanks

Gordon

[Jud]

Everyone seems to be an expert but none of you have listened to all of them so really keep your mouth or fingers off the keyboard.

 

I'd imagine folks in the industry like yourself who *have* listened to all of them, and have tech knowledge besides, risk suit if you comment on particular competitors' models. So then the field's left to reviewers, and what fun is that?

 

Slightly more seriously, I think the advice not to try to come off as an expert is perfect. So long as we are open about what else we've heard or haven't, what our subjective likes and dislikes are, the fact that we aren't DAC designers (unless we are), etc., then we can have our words taken for what they're worth. With a proper basis for evaluation, they may be of use to others, to the same extent any other word-of-mouth information might be. And those of us interested in this pursuit may find the conversation enjoyable.

[wgscott]

I bought one immediately. I have zero regrets. May I put my mouth back on the keyboard?

[Akapod]

Any thoughts on how this compares to the AudioEngine D2 (or D1)?

[wgscott]

WG-

 

Is that volume device you use good quality in audio terms, i.e., "transparent"?

 

 

I don't hear any noise, but it is yet one more USB device, has an (optional) LED, etc. It certainly has the potential for bad behavior, but I haven't had any problems with it. I use these sometimes for molecular graphics display, where it isn't a concern.

 

I understand that connected by USB it will become the master volume for the computer, so I could use it as a master volume for output to a USB DAC over an additional USB port on the computer?

 

Not sure I follow. It is yet another USB device. The computer I have this on is for work, and has a lot of other potentially worse compromises.

 

Thanks

 

You are more than welcome.

[Sumflow]

Gordons recent reply goes straight to the heart of what I was saying.

C'mon don't knock their output stage and DAC implementation just because Gordon didn't design them.

I am in the market to upgrade my Dac to one with Gordon Rankin’s Streamlength USB protocol.

I said lets do this, and AQ wanted a dac with minimum phase filters. .. I said look let me make what I originally suggested.

Nothing great was ever created by committee. If Gordon does the whole design it will be better. I drive a Porsche not a Corvette. What I would like to know is what is Gordon working on now that does go into my Vintage McIntosh amp?

 

Is there any degradation of signal expected going from Dragonfly silver outlets adapting to RCAs. And what would be the best way to do this, adapters, wires etc. or just go with a pure RCA design.

[wgscott]

 

You posted a picture of the answer to your question.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But you already knew that.

[Sumflow]

You posted a picture of the answer to your question.

Which question?

..what is Gordon working on now?

What he designing now?

..is there any degradation of signal going to RCAs?

Or degradation of signal using an adapter?

[steve lonner]

 

Everyone seems to be an expert but none of you have listened to all of them so really keep your mouth or fingers off the keyboard... you don't hear musicians calling foul on guitars they just don't buy them. Audiophiles should be more like that and really go out an listen before you purchase or make comments.

 

 

Gordon, Is it safe to assume that you are saying that for those of us who are not experts (for example me) we should listen to things before we comment on them, but not that we shouldn't state opinions about the dacs we've heard?

 

If so I agree, but if you are saying non-experts shouldn't even state opinions about equipment they have listened to (after making their experience level clear) then I disagree. It is of great value to me to read what other people like me think. The expectations of a professional reviewer and/or product designer are loftier and more nuanced than mine and it is probably more helpful to me to hear what average people think about a product I might buy.

 

All that said, I have ordered one of these based on the great things I've read about your products both by pros and average home users and can't wait to hear it in person.

[AudioDoctor]

Sumflow, you can read all about Gordons products here:

 

Wavelength Audio, USB DACS, Cardinal, Napoleon, Crimson, Cosecant, Brick, Royal, SIne, Tube DACS, SET Amplifiers

[Sumflow]

 

Sumflow, you can read all about Gordons products here:

 

Wavelength Audio, USB DACS, Cardinal, Napoleon, Crimson, Cosecant, Brick, Royal, SIne, Tube DACS, SET Amplifiers

Mahalo - I don't see the Dragonfly or the Halide on those pages. The concept page was the most interesting. Does anyone know how the Dragonfly should sound compared to the Halide Design Dac Hd?

 

Will these new advanced, lower priced products, put pressure on the pricing of older products, or do you think they be able to stand on there own a while longer at any price?

[AudioDoctor]

 

Mahalo - I don't see the Dragonfly or the Halide on those pages. The concept page was the most interesting. Does anyone know how the Dragonfly should sound compared to the Halide Design Dac Hd?

 

Will these new advanced, lower priced products, put pressure on the pricing of older products, or do you think they be able to stand on there own a while longer at any price?

 

You will have to go to those companies websites if you would like to learn about them. I think you should buy both, and return the one you don't like.

[TimDH]

I was wondering if Gordon or anyone could tell us the output impedance for this DAC- important for low impedance IEM headphones.

 

Thanks,

Tim

[chg]

Gordon, Is it safe to assume that you are saying that for those of us who are not experts (for example me) we should listen to things before we comment on them, but not that we shouldn't state opinions about the dacs we've heard?

 

If so I agree, but if you are saying non-experts shouldn't even state opinions about equipment they have listened to (after making their experience level clear) then I disagree. It is of great value to me to read what other people like me think. The expectations of a professional reviewer and/or product designer are loftier and more nuanced than mine and it is probably more helpful to me to hear what average people think about a product I might buy.

 

All that said, I have ordered one of these based on the great things I've read about your products both by pros and average home users and can't wait to hear it in person.

 

I think, all he is saying is that people who know very little about the technical aspects of audio components (myself included), design goals, etc., are very quick to judge/comment/criticize on the net. Imagine if you were a respected audio designer with hours of study, research, and knowledge and you had to endure some of these random comments. I think I would be more than a little irritated.

[Sumflow]

output impedance for this DAC- important for low impedance IEM headphones.

Tim I don't speak impedance but will this help Drives Headphones Directly?

 

Output voltage: ~= 2vrms

Minimum headphone impedance ~= 12 ohms

Maximum driving power: = 150mW

[Jud]

I was wondering if Gordon or anyone could tell us the output impedance for this DAC- important for low impedance IEM headphones.

 

Thanks,

Tim

 

Is the Etymotic ER-4P a low impedance IEM? 'Cause the Dragonfly sounds effing great with mine.

[Paul R]

 

Oooookay.... is it just me, or do those thingamajigs look like they are filled with beer to other people too?

A bitters perhaps...

 

-Paul

[AudioDoctor]

Oooookay.... is it just me, or do those thingamajigs look like they are filled with beer to other people too?

A bitters perhaps...

 

-Paul

 

The "beer" even appears to have some "head"

 

[labjr]

I think the next logical step for Gordon is to add a computerized player to make it a complete High Resolution personal audio player like an Ipod?

[realhifi]

Flavors...

 

Look there are a lot of flavors of dacs out there. Everyone seems to be an expert but none of you have listened to all of them so really keep your mouth or fingers off the keyboard. None of us listen the same way or for the same purpose. It's like guitars... you don't hear musicians calling foul on guitars they just don't buy them. Audiophiles should be more like that and really go out an listen before you purchase or make comments.

 

Thanks

Gordon

 

The guitar analogy is perfect! The notion of an absolute, even in price class feels restrictive and impossible with all the variations becoming available today, both with guitars and DACs. Wine analogies are also instructive where what is the perfect Pinot Gris to one person may have too much pear notes to another.

 

It is refreshing to have an industry leader reflect these ideas. Thanks.