iTunes masters.What's this all about...?

[Mark Powell]

Nothing wrong with Bentleys. A friend has got one. They are Volkswagens really. Biggest selling 'really expensive' car in the world by far. The owners did not get to afford them by being mugs.

 

[Sik_Lescinovid]

Coca-Cola is far more influential than Apple, financially and culturally.

 

Masses will remain ignorant and quality will be scarce, regardless of the existence of Apple.

 

[Mark Powell]

In Europe it's just fizzy pop for kids. Just one of hundreds of different sorts. They soon grow out of it. It is not an 'influence'.

 

[PeterSt]

Windows and its compatible players just work. And work well. We don't get this long stream of constant problems (Amarra, BitPerfect, Pure Music, Mac Mini any good, things stop working on Lion...it is endless). Windows just does the job. And minorities are often vociferous.

 

Maybe it helps one or two (sure not more) when I say I fully agree with this. But, you out there, not knowing about anything else, take all the sh*t for granted. Somehow. It *is* all one long stream of inoperable things within the Apple you know. Just read this forum.

And also : I just can't for the life of me imagine how you Apple people can think all works so nicely transparent (talking audio players only). Nothing does. All needs various screens (tasks) at the same time to actually control one player - always guessing whether things will get through to that other task (what about sample rate changes), while all on Windows is made self contained. The Apple way is the cheap way. It's made convenient for developers. But now it is not for you as the user.

Still don't see it ? well, then you don't, but this is the problen; Windows users do.

 

Ok, end rant. But when you feel the atmosphere of the above (or IOW what's really in my head) then maybe you can feel how Mark comes to his ever and ever "ranting" about Apple stuff. There is nothing much I disagree with, but there is a difference - I don't let know much about my feelings. OK, I just did. Could do it the whole day, if that would be my interest.

 

But another small rant, as how I *really* see it :

 

Apple people live in their own world. They like what they see, and next tell Windows users that they don't know what it is all about. Also, the fact that "some" hopped over tells me nothing. My wife did too. She likes it. But I said it before, when real things have to happen, she goes to Windows. Just a normal user, but with some more interest than playing around a little. Yes, that is how I see it. This creates hostility in me. And again, I really could talk the whole day like I do in this post. It is only that I don't.

Already the "fact" that the "eureka's" pop up daily within the Apple environment. Eureka's which were called for, what ? 10 years back in the Windows environment ? Really. Sometimes it gets too much. Lightyears behind.

 

Won't post like this again. :-)

Peter

 

[Mark Powell]

"in order to select the Integer Mode check box you also have to enable Memory Play and Preallocate. Memory play is selected from the main sidebar of PM, and Preallocate is selected from the Preferences setup window. And Hog Mode must have been selected and PM restarted before Integer Mode is available"

 

And they say Windows/JRiver is difficult?

 

[PeterSt]

You forgot to select the proper OS first.

 

[PeterSt]

And check the debug info of course. Because you can only be sure once that's observed.

 

If you know what to look for of course.

 

[Audio_ELF]

First off, in response to ac3220's points... 1) hey, I don't think you can "blame" Apple for the iPhone 4S vs 4. It takes about 30 seconds to find a comparison of the two models. Oh it's not like Apple are the only phone company doing similar. At least, to a large extent, the "updates" in the operating system are available to users of the old devices unlike many of the Android phones. Yes there are new features in iOS5 only available to iPhone 4S purchasers but that's inevitable. And it's not as though a precedence wasn't set with the iPhones 3G to 3GS update.

 

To refute Mark... It's not a "rip-off" it's a customer choice!! It would be a rip-off if the iPhone 4 stopped working... But that's not the case. Demonstratable by the number of iPhones 3GS activations there were over the last 12 months!

 

Back to ac3320... I agree, fan boys give Apple a bad name and will always wind people up. But personally I think worse are the anti-fan-boys.

 

And back to Mark... I would agree that Apple is one of the most influential companies in the world, but Google and Facebook are certainly pushing their way forward, Microsoft and Oracle are still up there and that's without mentioning the big Hollywood studios, companies such as Coca Cola and McDonalds and the big industrial companies such as Unileaver. But I ask, how did all these companies get to be influential: well mostly by (a) providing the services and goods we the consumer wanted and (b) by pressuring the already influential companies that we loved to hate (in Apple's case they took on first the Music Labels and then Cellphone service companies) which usually at the time we cheered :-)

 

Your next paragraph I have refuted similar before and will again, for the man in the street an iDevice with dock is probably superior to previous music reproduction methods they used. This is an opinion but I will stick by it. So no, Apple are improving the quality for the man in the street not destroying it!

 

You talk about Apple "don't give a damn about the rest of us, we are merely sources of money that they want" but I actually think Apple are making money by actually giving the consumer what they want - it may not be what YOU want but a large enough number of people (a little under 50% smart phone users for example) actually do want it.

 

Windows vs Mac OS X... That damned perpetual argument! At the end of the day (and for the end user) it's a choice... And choice is good. Both operating systems can give good sound. But you also comment about the MacMini and the comments we get about the sound quality and how to improve it ... But you can't compare this to custom built (for audio) CAPS or Aurality, etc. To compare apples to erm apples, you really should compare to Dell or HP or Acer...

 

If you actually read the paper with an open mind, I think Apple are saying that compression is bad, but realises that the the record labels use it. They are NOT promoting the use of compression. One thing (I think) Mastered for iTunes is including is Sound Check profiles so that any compression is done at playback time *if the user desires*.

 

As for your Jobs and Wosniak comment it's quite frankly irrelevant who the technical driving force behind the Apple I, Apple II and Macintosh were. Apple as a company is completely different entity from when Wosniak was involved. Jobs was instrumental in turning Apple from a close to bankrupt minority player into the global success it is today. Say the success is down to Jonothan Ives if you want: that's closer to the truth. A company like Apple isn't about one person, it's about putting together the right people!

 

If you have no interest in Apple products fine; if you have problems with their manufacturing in China, fine. But you speak using retoric and half truths rather than any real facts that define a company.

 

[Mark Powell]

Between the lines. For example, how they 'connect' 16/44.1 CD standard to their low bit rate stuff, for example. You will see they make similar invalid connections all the way through. And talk about their 'amazing' sound quality? It is a very clever piece of work, but 'real' facts (much better than ordinary facts) don't come into it.

 

Windows. But that community can custom build an 'audio dedicated' machine easily, at a similar price to a mid-range Mac. Mac OS users cannot. They are stuck with a 'Dell' That is why my comparison is valid. Though, to be fair, Microsoft is a software house only, so I can see Apple's position, though they could perfectly well sell their OS to others, thus opening up the market. But they won't, you have to buy one of their machines.

 

However, for what little it is worth, I do see where you are coming from. Even I have been tempted to give one a try, but I don't have any use for another machine.

 

[nemick]

I find this thread is becoming a significant source of amusement for me. Whether one likes and uses a mac or a PC, iTunes or JRiver, we're still just talking about tools. If one tool doesn't work for you or you don't like it, use a different one. I use a mac at home and a PC at work. I don't care which platform I use as long as it works for the task I'm working on.

 

It's the same with iTunes and JRiver, they're tools. To each their own. Apple aren't responsible for dumbing down anyone, any more than Microsoft are. They are simply providing tools that their customers find desirable and therefore, profitable.

 

I guess I just don't see it as being a tool manufacturers responsibility to educate anyone.

 

[wgb113]

That's a very good point in regards to the already "MFI" 24/96 file vs. a flat file. You're right.

 

As to the whole gist of this thing, as others have said most of us here don't buy music from the iTunes store because we are the minority that prefer better sound quality than what they offer. To vilify Apple for "dumbing down" music is misleading because you're assuming that people actually care about the sound quality of their music and the fact is that they don't or the market would demand better.

 

SACD and DVD-A are all but dead because people didn't care. HiRez remains a very small niche because people still don't care. Music is a soundtrack to other activities for the mass market. It's unfortunate for those of us that still make serious listening an activity but all we can do is buy the highest quality format available to us as opposed to lower-quality.

 

Until people (if ever) start caring about sound quality our small slice of the market clamoring for better sound will remain that way...small. It's not Apple's fault but at this point in time it's frustrating that they're probably the only company that could bring HiRez to the mass market and haven't yet.

 

If there's a silver lining I think it's in the increase in aftermarket headphones because it shows that more and more white earbud iPod listeners ARE beginning to seek out better sound. They may eventually work their way up to a headphone amp, perhaps a DAC after that and before you know it our demographic might actually GROW!

 

It's one reason we need to welcome and encourage those new to this hobby and lead them with baby steps into the right gear.

 

Bill

 

[Mark Powell]

It is for everyone. I, and I expect many others, have learnt, and are learning, a whole lot from this site. But it is amusement as well.

 

BTW: Your avatar, many years ago, lived only a couple of miles from me (Southampton, UK). He really was a milkman.

 

[nemick]

I was born and raised just outside Walsall in the West Midlands. I still miss it from time to time. Benny Hill is still very popular over here in the US.

 

[MaxSeven]

I hate the term "Hog Mode." It sounds so jargonistic and banal. "Integer Mode" is starting to get on my nerves as well.

 

 

 

[James1776]

You wrote "SACD and DVD-A are all but dead because people didn't care"...In my case I DID care and was an early buyer but, when I paid the premium for the gear, and then bought the disks, I found my selection was dross, crap at the best. I had no desire to spend $20 for my very own copy of 'Ethel Snyder and her all girl kazoo band plays Gershwin'...

 

 

 

[goldsdad]

"Goldsdad, I have to disagree...

You wrote "SACD and DVD-A are all but dead because people didn't care"..."

 

I never wrote anything like that. I never mentioned SACD or DVD-A.

 

[James1776]

You are absolutely right...I was quoting 'wgb113', not you...again, sorry

 

[VandyMan]

deleted (was too harsh)

 

[realhifi]

that some folks may be eating the proverbial crow in the not too distant future vis a vis Apple and their awful iTunes store. All signs are pointing towards Apple selling music soon at a higher resolutions than they offer now through their recently open sourced ALAC format. Of course if it is 24/96 then there will be folks that complain that it isn't in 24/192. In fact I'm betting that it will be this year.

 

[scobek]

Not so fussed about "Integer Mode". I just wish I knew what it meant.

 

[Audio_ELF]

http://www.cepro.com/article/apples_mastered_for_itunes_is_it_legit/

 

And he's British so he must be right... :-)

 

Eloise

 

[new_media]

So the take home point there is if you want your AAC files to sound like a CD, encode them from a CD?

 

[Teresa]

For me it raises many questions.

 

I wonder if "AAC Plus lossless high-resolution format" could mean ALAC (Apple Lossless)? If so we may actually get real high resolution lossless downloads from the iTunes Store since ALAC is up to 24/192kHz resolution.

 

Could this be the main reason Apple is requesting 24/96kHz files if available from the record companies?

 

"Apple recommends to mastering engineers not to compress a track."

This I think is great news, Apple may just push others to end the loudness wars.

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi Teresa - I believe Apple's recommendation to not compress a track is about codecs and file compression rather than dynamic range compression. Dynamic range compression and the loudness wars are an artistic choice that's part of the creation of the art.

 

Do you read the information different?

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

"I have a feeling... that some folks may be eating the proverbial crow in the not too distant future vis a vis Apple and their awful iTunes store."

 

Hi realhifi - Can you expand on this or maybe explain it to me? I understand the colloquialism of eating crow, but not the rest of your comments.