High Resolution Audio Isn't Coming Soon From Apple

iTunes users spend an average of $12 per year on music:

 

iTunes users spend a lot on apps and music, not so much on ebooks (chart) — Tech News and Analysis

 

However, this is around the world, including a lot of countries with a lot of people where the cost of living is much lower than in the major western countries.

 

But, if you can get 1/10 of those users to spend $10 a month, that's a lot of money indeed.

 

Kirk

The headline figure is interesting but not very useful.

First off, I suspect there are lots of Apple IDs with zero purchases of music - I wonder what "average" we get if we eliminate these.

Even within those IDs where some music is purchased; there will be many where there is perhaps 1 or 2 album a year sold.

Eloise

This is the SACD story (in a different guise) all over again...

And it's depressing. It really is.

I'm fed up trying to bash my head against a brick wall with streaming DSD and HiRez..

It's actually easy to stream these files. It really is. It's just nobody in industry gives a rats to bring it all together...

But Apple is not the only ones to blame here.. Sonos is a huge culprit. For their blatant neglect of Hirez formats. As is Linn: For not placing enough emphasis and throwing enough capital at doing the *software* side properly.. I'm over it frankly..

Of course they won't be interested in selling hi-rez. If the world is happy drinking horse-piss and you can sell it to them, why try to convert them to vintage wine.

And it's depressing. It really is.

 

I'm fed up trying to bash my head against a brick wall with streaming DSD and HiRez..

 

It's actually easy to stream these files. It really is. It's just nobody in industry gives a rats to bring it all together...

Patience grasshopper. I am on my patio right now listening to (supposedly) crappy music streaming from Pandora and digging it. Sure it's through less than high fidelity outdoor speakers but in the moment, the sun streaming through the trees, the birds chirping, the calm of (finally!) a summers eve so sweet, listening to Pat Metheny Trio plying their magic sounds sublime.

Patience grasshopper. I am on my patio right now listening to (supposedly) crappy music streaming from Pandora and digging it. Sure it's through less than high fidelity outdoor speakers but in the moment, the sun streaming through the trees, the birds chirping, the calm of (finally!) a summers eve so sweet, listening to Pat Metheny Trio plying their magic sounds sublime.

Well exactly. That is precisely what I do. When I want to listen to music, I listen to 16 bit (because it's easy to do). When I want to play computer geek, I switch over to 24 bit and DSD.. Sad but true. That is the reality of where we are at with all this right now

Well exactly. That is precisely what I do. When I want to listen to music, I listen to 16 bit (because it's easy to do). When I want to play computer geek, I switch over to 24 bit and DSD.. Sad but true. That is the reality of where we are at with all this right now

It feels so easy to me.

I've never felt like hifi was ever easier than it is right now.

I was reminiscing as I sat listening and choosing music how difficult it used to be to pipe music in different areas and then go and flip the record when it ended! Crazy convenience at our fingertips now.

Macs default to 16/44.1, but you can change this in the Audio-MIDI Setup app, which most users don't even know exists.

 

Kirk

Very Nice Job Chris!

I have been feeling your thoughts ever since BM(an apt acronym,eh?) purchased MOG and shuddered when Apple bought BM(BM(and Apple) don't care about 'US', only care about people who listen on i-devices) and you confirmed my feelings- i now only listen to HiFi Qobuz and my aiff ripped discs on stored in iTUNES(UGH)-16bits/44.1kHz LOSSLESS FLAC(Qobuz) is great sound for me. I have been 'raving' to the idiots at BM for 6 months about their web browser-its next to unusable and as great as their 'support team' is or was they were too young- some didn't know who The Dead were(or Phish for that matter) and their selection of 'Intros' to The Dead and the Stones didn't include 'Ripple' or 'Sweet Virginia'-that says a lot right there. Neither of them care about sound or us ol'farts who listen at home and just want great sound.

Your article was very well put thankyou.bobbmd

Have you never heard of the argument it's better to have 25% of a £1,000,000,000 business than 100% of a £1,000,000 business?

Have you never heard the record companies whine, after someone else (Apple) took their 100% of a £1,000,000 business and turned it into a £1,000,000,000 business, that the £1,000,000,000 business could and should have been theirs, all theirs? That's the point of Chris's Point Two: The record companies have convinced themselves it wasn't Apple. Someone making jillions from downloads was inevitable and it should have been them, never Apple, and if they'd just hung on to all their own music, they would've been iTunes, dammit! So it will be a cold day in hell before you see them turn over the family jewels to Apple again.

Have you never heard the record companies whine, after someone else (Apple) took their 100% of a £1,000,000 business and turned it into a £1,000,000,000 business, that the £1,000,000,000 business could and should have been theirs, all theirs? That's the point of Chris's Point Two: The record companies have convinced themselves it wasn't Apple. Someone making jillions from downloads was inevitable and it should have been them, never Apple, and if they'd just hung on to all their own music, they would've been iTunes, dammit! So it will be a cold day in hell before you see them turn over the family jewels to Apple again.

Yeah, they'd rather go broke again. Of course the other side of the coin is that Apple also basically saved the industry when iTunes came out. They were dead in the water with no oars and sinking fast with the torrent of free music that was available.

Now here we are with streaming and "radio" services and on demand music exploding and the labels are caught watching and scratching their heads once again. Afraid the song's been sung already or as Jimmy Lovine says in an interview, "that joke has already been told". High resolution anything that is related to music will not save anyone in the industry. The profit ship has already sailed. See that "Mastered for iTunes" stamp on new recordings offered by Apple? Think that's just a sales gimmick? It's already a done deal. Not only that but I think Jimmy Lovine knew this when Apple came a knocking. Who will care if their music is 24/44 or 24/192 as long as it is "better" than what is offered now? Maybe 1% or less of the music listening customers?

Yeah, they'd rather go broke again. Of course the other side of the coin is that Apple also basically saved the industry when iTunes came out. They were dead in the water with no oars and sinking fast with the torrent of free music that was available.

 

Now here we are with streaming and "radio" services and on demand music exploding and the labels are caught watching and scratching their heads once again. Afraid the song's been sung already or as Jimmy Lovine says in an interview, "that joke has already been told". High resolution anything that is related to music will not save anyone in the industry. The profit ship has already sailed. See that "Mastered for iTunes" stamp on new recordings offered by Apple? Think that's just a sales gimmick? It's already a done deal. Not only that but I think Jimmy Lovine knew this when Apple came a knocking. Who will care if their music is 24/44 or 24/192 as long as it is "better" than what is offered now? Maybe 1% or less of the music listening customers?

It's spelled iovine :~)

It's spelled iovine :~)

Yeah, caught that but you commented before I could edit it!

Apple's customers listen to music on Iphones with white earbuds. The sound quality is good enough to get the information of the music across. There is not significant demand for hi-rez; there is not even much demand for CD quality files.

If there were a demand that would make money, Apple or someone would figure out a way to provide a full supply.

It's spelled iovine :~)

I thought it was McLovin?

Yeah, they'd rather go broke again. Of course the other side of the coin is that Apple also basically saved the industry when iTunes came out. They were dead in the water with no oars and sinking fast with the torrent of free music that was available.

 

Right, which is exactly what they've conveniently edited from their collective memories now as the business begins to stagnate again. Though the basis for stagnation actually has less to do with their business decisions at this point and more to do with the lack of compelling musicians who will speak to this generation as the Beatles did to mine. Right now we seem to be in something similar to the late 50s-early 60s slough when "artists" were essentially pretty-boy and pretty-girl marketing confections. Look at the best selling songs and most of them come from movie soundtracks - marketing. Right now there are songs marketing can make people want to buy, but there's no music important enough that people *need* to hear it. Until there is, I don't think the numbers will pick up appreciably.

Right, which is exactly what they've conveniently edited from their collective memories now as the business begins to stagnate again. Though the basis for stagnation actually has less to do with their business decisions at this point and more to do with the lack of compelling musicians who will speak to this generation as the Beatles did to mine. Right now we seem to be in something similar to the late 50s-early 60s slough when "artists" were essentially pretty-boy and pretty-girl marketing confections. Look at the best selling songs and most of them come from movie soundtracks - marketing. Right now there are songs marketing can make people want to buy, but there's no music important enough that people *need* to hear it. Until there is, I don't think the numbers will pick up appreciably.

Good call. That resonates with a comment Mr Iovine made in an interview about how much an artist has to say and that NOBODY has 16 songs worth to put on an album.

My 15 yr old son has started collecting current Pop Punk eps (forgot how nice those were) which have 4-5 songs on them and they seem to speak to a disaffected portion of the youth of today. Either that or he just digs the cool labels and fold outs!

Hmmm..... I'm going to have to disagree about the overall quality of today's music being inferior to that of ths 60's and 70's. In terms of the quality of the music, I think the situation is better today than it was in the 60's and 70's.

Hmmm..... I'm going to have to disagree about the overall quality of today's music being inferior to that of ths 60's and 70's. In terms of the quality of the music, I think the situation is better today than it was in the 60's and 70's.

I'm not qualified to speak to the "overall quality" of any era's music. My remarks were geared more to the thought that among today's best-selling musicians I don't personally see someone whose music is as meaningful to this generation as The Beatles and Dylan were to mine. But I don't say this from the standpoint of wanting to be correct, and I'd be delighted to learn from anyone about candidates (here or in other threads like Album of the Evening).

Interesting article, I've been skeptical of the hi-res move from Apple myself. They can't even get together the iWatch or iTV that have been talked about for years in the rumor mills. I just personally don't think there is enough interest, everyone I talk to about hi-res literally knows nothing about it, only on audio circles like this or Head-Fi is it even really understood, most people could just care less unfortunately and will buy whatever is cheapest, whether it's streaming services like Spotify or cheaper lossy iTunes downloads.

I think it's a matter of when they plan on releasing products with built-in 24 Bit DACs.

One thing I saw months ago was that Daniel Hertz was going to start selling his M8 and M9 products through Apple Stores. This is a $7,000 system and that I heard that his system won't be shipping until Oct time frame. I don't if that's a coincidence or not, but it would make sense that it was.

Now, typically Apple has refreshed the iPod lineup in Sept/Oct, but last year they didn't do this. Maybe Apple is planning on this type of refresh.

I would personally think that Apple, MIGHT (I'm not saying they WILL because I don't know), but it's possible that if they are going to turn on 24 Bit files this year, it'll be done in Sept./Oct and that there should be at least one hardware announcement of a music listening device that has a 24 Bit DAC internally and that would have to be an iPod (Touch) at minimum. I just thought that expecting it at WWDC is the wrong time frame. Yeah, it would be nice, but I think when they decide to release it, it'll be more of a Sept/Oct thing just before Christmas.

One thing is Apple's not reliant on 24Bit file sales rescuing Apple iTunes. It's more of a "guess what we have?" type product rather than a "The biggest revolution since the iPod type of product". For it to make sense for Apple to go 24 Bit, they would have to have hardware that plays 24 Bit files right out of the gate.

1. That's a valid point of high res streaming impacting the Cellular carriers. I don't know if high res will only be restricted to downloading through WiFi/traditional ISP and not be allowed through cellular data.

2. That's got nothing to do with it. They need revenue any way they can get it and releasing 24 Bit for ITunes would help bring more revenue from the masses, but it's a little more complicated than that. It's called how fast can they pump out remastered content? They are only releasing a small handful of stuff for everyone else and that's not that much. So, from Apple's perspective, I would think that they would want a MUCH higher number of remastered content happening a LOT faster than it is.

3. Beats has nothing to do with 24 Bit on their streaming service. that's just for people that want to pay for basically a radio service and that'll just be restricted to 16 Bit for a long time. It's not a big deal to change the s/w and release 24 Bit when they get to that point, but I don't think Beats is the reason why Apple hasn't released 24 Bit file downloads.

4. Probably collecting it until it reaches a big enough level so when they do release it, they already have a bunch of content to actually sell. Nothing worse than announcing something and there's nothing to sell.

5. Apple is a specs company when they CAN be a specs company. I think for some things they are ahead of the curve and some things not. They did release 24 Bit ARM tablets/smartphones a long time before anyone else. But I think the 24 Bit situation is much more complex. HTC has it because to them, it's just releasing h/w, HTC doesn't have a music service unless they were planning on Beats being that Music service and things just fell apart as a result. HTC is grasping for sales so they kind of have to add functionality to set them apart, so they decided to release 24 Bit h/w now instead of a 64 Bit Processor first. Apple decided to release a 64 Bit processor before a 24 Bit internal DAC. HTC doesn't have a music download site to content with. But I don't see HTC spending a lot of money promoting this fact.

6. I don't think that's as big of a part of it. It's just not viewed AS important right now. When Apple does flip the switch, depending on how great their lossy version sounds compared to lossless, Apple may capture the majority of high res sales and force a lot of these others to right out of business. That's what some might view this as.

7. Making iTunes automatically switch is a trivial problem, since Apple doesn't ship anything with 24 Bit internal DACs, it's not high up on the priority list to change. The 3rd party crowd like BitPerfect, Amarra, PureMusic, Audirvana, and JRiver do this and people that listen to 24 Bit will buy these s/w apps for automatically switching as one of the many reasons. I think it's not a reason why they aren't bringing out 24 Bit files. I think it's more of they aren't fixing it until they release h/w with 24 Bit internal DACs is more like it.

Conclusion. I think it's safer to say they are going to flip the switch, but it may/may not be this year. If they do flip the switch, it'll probably be Sept/Oct this year at the soonest, but it may be held off until next year.

Hi Chris,

 

I agree with all of your points. When it comes to lossless streaming, I think it was you who said that the founder of MOG said he would have had to charge $30 per month to satisfy the studios. This is pretty much what Qobuz and WiMP get when converted to US dollars. Apple would never do this. The market would be too small, it would have to be limited to home high-speed connections and it would cannibalize Beats. I think they will just leave it to Qobuz, WiMP and a few others until they see real money in doing it. Pono should be doing it on a limited basis to drive purchases from their store. One thing we have to remember is that to the majority of listeners out there, CD quality is hi-res. Great article

When did Apple start selling Lossless downloads in the first place? AAC is lossy. I would be interested in seeing how their AAC 24 Bit files will sound in comparison to AIFF/FLAC/ALAC 24 Bit files that everyone else sells.

I think it's partly amassing a large enough chest of 24 Bit files. Having a couple of thousand albums on iTunes at 24 Bit is SMALL, that won't put any major dent in iTunes, maybe they are waiting to have a couple of HUNDRED thousand albums before they flip the switch. The number of albums on HD Tracks is Boutique level, that's not going to get Apple's upper management excited. Having 1 Million 24 Bit files ready to download is a little more enticing. And how many 24 Bit files are there on HD Tracks? A thousand? Two Thousand? Ten Thousands? That's chump change. Plus, with Apple's model, they like selling individual songs whereas HDTracks, etc. sells mostly complete albums. Which makes more sense from a revenue perspective. Plus, right now, they have to constantly discount 24 Bit files to at least 10% to 15% off, so that makes me think they are charging too much.

I think it's a matter of when they plan on releasing products with built-in 24 Bit DACs.

 

One thing I saw months ago was that Daniel Hertz was going to start selling his M8 and M9 products through Apple Stores. This is a $7,000 system and that I heard that his system won't be shipping until Oct time frame. I don't if that's a coincidence or not, but it would make sense that it was.

 

Now, typically Apple has refreshed the iPod lineup in Sept/Oct, but last year they didn't do this. Maybe Apple is planning on this type of refresh.

 

I would personally think that Apple, MIGHT (I'm not saying they WILL because I don't know), but it's possible that if they are going to turn on 24 Bit files this year, it'll be done in Sept./Oct and that there should be at least one hardware announcement of a music listening device that has a 24 Bit DAC internally and that would have to be an iPod (Touch) at minimum. I just thought that expecting it at WWDC is the wrong time frame. Yeah, it would be nice, but I think when they decide to release it, it'll be more of a Sept/Oct thing just before Christmas.

 

One thing is Apple's not reliant on 24Bit file sales rescuing Apple iTunes. It's more of a "guess what we have?" type product rather than a "The biggest revolution since the iPod type of product". For it to make sense for Apple to go 24 Bit, they would have to have hardware that plays 24 Bit files right out of the gate.

The thought of a "new" iPod is an intriguing prospect. Make it cool, able to play 24 bit music, herald it as the latest in portable music listening, pair it with Beats headphones, give it wifi so you could purchase right to it. At the same time refresh the iTunes Store with 24 bit music and make a real splash with commercials, ads, etc. aimed at a young audience. The iPod, along with iTunes, turned Apple around. Making it into a big deal with both new hardware AND better sounding music would reintroduce Apple as the coolest kids in the class again. What are the latest iPods capicity, 160GB? That is a lot of high res files. The iPod still has a page on Apple's website all by it's lonesome making me believe it's not dead yet.

Chris,

Here's something that negates your opinion that the mobile carriers are against high-resolution streaming:

T-Mobile gives Subscribers Free Music Streaming for iTunes Radio, More - The Mac Observer

T-Mobile is offering to its clients to not count the data they use when streaming music. My guess is that this will become a common loss-leader for mobile phone operators. Given that only a tiny handful of people would ever want to stream high-res music, it's clear that it's not going to bother carriers.

Kirk