Build An Audiophile Music Server (CA04)

Hey pga - The Mac Pro / Lynx AES16e is one of the best solutions available today! I haven't seen anything that suggests iTunes can't playback 24/176.4 content bit perfect, but I have some questions into a couple contacts to verify this.<br />

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About the SRC in iTunes<br />

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This is from the Benchmark site:<br />

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<i>iTunes 7 Performance under Mac and Windows<br />

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iTunes sample-rate conversion (SRC) is greatly improved from version 6. In fact, SRC with iTunes 7 is of such quality that it is virtually inaudible (more about this below). iTunes 7 will establish a 24-bit connection with the audio engine of the operating system. iTunes 7 also provides a high-quality, 24-bit dithered volume control – a major improvement when compared to the non-dithered 16-bit controls in prior versions.</i><br />

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I don't know of a real good way of getting AES/EBU from the Mini. I'm not a big fan of converting the signal just to change from something like USB to AES or FireWire to AES etc... <br />

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It is actually quite good timing to be discussing this now. I just received an email from Reference Recordings, literally 10 minutes ago. They'll be sending me an advanced press copy of the HRx 24/176.4 material very soon! I guess we'll know sooner than later if iTunes will output this stuff bit perfect!

Chris - great website, thanks !<br />

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So I have my new very quiet Vista 64 quad core computer with 8GB RAM & am putting together a system using some old audiophile gear that my wife will not allow in our new living room + a USB DAC.... what is the next best SIMPLE way of getting bit perfect sound from iTunes to my DAC, please !? I would REALLY like to avoid having to install any additional program interfaces if possible. If the AE could acommodate a USB DAC (which I think it will not ?), I'd get one tomorrow...<br />

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J.

Hey Hey jtrade - Welcome to the site. Sorry for the delayed response, lots going on around here today!<br />

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Let me think about this one a little bit. I know there is a solution. I know price isn't everything but how much are you willing to spend on this? <br />

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Chris - I'd like to spend as little as possible, but no less (with apologies to Einstein...).<br />

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For this, my first computer-based system, I am combining some original British gear which I bought new in the '80s with some "modern bits" :<br />

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HotAudio USB DAC http://www.hotaudio.com/zen-cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=68&products_id=184<br />

HotAudio Custom RCA interconnect http://www.hotaudio.com/high-fidelity-rca-cables.php<br />

Onix OA21 amplifier (warm sounding and I love it)<br />

Anti-Cables http://www.anticables.com/home.html<br />

Linn Kans (Linn's fantastic rework of the BBC LS3/5a mini monitor)<br />

REL sub (prob will not use as my office is only 10 ft square !)<br />

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I am looking for great, untiring "musicality", that magical quality that elevates the enjoyment of a system way beyond the sum of its individual parts. My DAC choice may be at the low end in terms of cost, but I was influenced by the opinions of a respected, specialist British outfit, whose latest speaker product, the ADM9, builds in not only amplification, but also the DAC: http://www.avihifi.co.uk/avid/avid.html .<br />

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Having read lots of posts on various forums, I am going to start by ripping CDs in Apple Lossless (I have read your recent comments re AIFF) and I am also keeping in mind my next living room system, which will have to overcome the challenge of my wife's aesthetic resistance to anything intrusive. I'm thinking iPod>iTransport>maybe ADM9s.... but that's a little further down the road.<br />

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Maybe I need to change my DAC for one with an optical input fed from an AE (assuming I can hardwire the AE from my computer via Ethernet (which means going through a router, btw) ? I do have WiFi output from the new computer, but I am generally anti-wireless !<br />

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J.<br />

jtrade,<br />

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You sound like you are on my type of wavelength!<br />

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I remember that the Linn Kans and to an even greater extent, the Linn Saras delivered that elusive essence of the music, that which moves and inspires us.<br />

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Use the Rel and drive your wife and your neighbours mad. Music isn't half what it could be without the bass foundation.<br />

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If you are at the starting point in your ripping regime, learn from those who have paved the way before us - go AIFF from the outset. You will not be sorry. (And by the way, be careful of Gracenote as you rip. Pop, Rock, Jazz etc is OK. Classical is appallingly inaccurate especially if there is more than one disc for the work.)<br />

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Baxtus

Chris: thanks much for pulling this all together. I have been working on DIY computer servers for a few years and appreciate all the hard work.<br />

Current System:<br />

Windows XP<br />

Chaintek 24/192 capable soundcard<br />

Coax digital connection from soundcard to NuForce DAC/preamp<br />

iTunes (like you, I prefer it); AIFF rips via iTunes with error correction<br />

WMP (for Music Giants and Linn high rez files)<br />

NetRemote (for remote iTunes and WMP control via a wireless PDA and wireless laptop-- my server sits two floors away from my listening area; I run a long coax digital cable). For the audiophiles out there, the computer server is fed to system with AudioRearch tube amps, MFA tube preamp, fully ModWright-modified Sony SACD player (with a tube output stage). The Music Giants downloads compare pretty favorably to the identical music on SACD.<br />

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1. KMixer bypass: other than using Airport Express what are the methods for bypassing KMixer? Is there any tool to confirm whether you are getting bit perfect output or if KMixer is screwing things up (btw, what bad stuff does KMixer do)? I have made all the setting change recommendations on the Benchmark website and am curious about any more. your quote:<br />

"Earlier I mentioned bit perfect output on this Windows PC. Accomplishing this is not something I find convenient or enjoyable in most circumstances. By far the easiest way to get bit perfect output on a PC is to use Apple's Airport Express. Using the AE, music is sent out the Ethernet/WLAN card bypassing the KMixer (XP) or any other audio manipulation Windows may attempt."<br />

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2. High Rez files: what is your method for playing higher rez files on iTunes? My downloads from MusicGiants and Linn will not play on iTunes without iTunes converting and down-rezing the files. For now, I play those files via WMP. Btw, my display on my DAC correctly indicates the bit/sample rate of these files, so I am not sure if my set up is bit perfect or if KMixer is doing any nasties.

First post - Chris, thanks for the site and the forums to learn about and discuss the music system for the 21st century. I'm enjoying the series of music server designs.<br />

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Here's what I have so far, with a question directed to everyone towards budget DAC selection at the end.<br />

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For me computer audio started with just listening to internet radio off the laptop/desktop into a 2.1 Altec Lansing speaker system. A computer refresh freed up an older box for server duty. Learning about the Airport Express opened up way more options. Began thinking out how I could serve music in the house.<br />

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I sold off my 2 channel audio goodies years ago to get into home theatre. That setup is great for movies and sports, but I missed just listening to music. These days it's primarily Jazz (gimme the 50's and 60's, but there is a wealth of good stuff), with additional interest in Blues and Latin music.<br />

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I set up a system that works on the computer side - a laptop with Windows (when this is retired it will be reincarnated as a MacBook) that runs iTunes. I have the server downstairs - it was to be a file server and hold anything. It runs OpenSuse 10.3 and the data volume is a software mirrored 320 GB drive. Systems like this do not have the demands of a file server in business and so a dedicated box with a software mirror works well.<br />

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I mapped a drive from the laptop to the Music share on the server and use that as the back end for iTunes. I also connect to the server with the main pc downstairs, running Arch Linux with Amarok as the music player, though this is a wired connection. The speakers upstairs are connected via the AE. Works pretty well but I may need to rethink the placement of the wireless router. Next step is to start adding audio components.<br />

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Basically I will start from scratch with little budget and scrounging audio gear to get something going - kind of like when I was 14. (still have my Luxman T-1 tuner from the 80's) Then I can plan for upgrades. My only concern (having been ignorant of home audio for years) is getting a good budget DAC that has a compatible interface with the AE. <br />

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Phew - long post. Thanks to any and all who may have some suggestions for me.<br />

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Hey airdronian - Welcome to the site and thanks for the post. I'm sure many other readers are in your same position and just haven't asked the questions yet. I like your idea of sharing out a Suse volume. Great for audiophiles with computer skills. I'm not sure if you've read all the great press lately about Luxman. They are back with some great products!<br />

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A good budget DAC compatible with the AE will be very easy to come by. All you need is a TOSlink / SPDIF input. The AE has a mini TOSlink output. There are many cables around that have mini on one end and standard TOSlink on the other. The Apple store sells one and Monster Cable sells the LighSpeed 100 Mini optical to TOSlink.<br />

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My guess is that some of your home theater gear has TOSlink inputs. You could always test your setup through that gear and the AE. Otherwise, about how much do you want to spend on a DAC? A good budget DAC means many things to many people as I'm sure you know :-)

Hey thanks for the reply.<br />

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No haven't seen any Luxman press, I have been looking at Audiogon for the hybrid integrated. I also used to have one of the nice dd turntables from the 80's....<br />

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The HT receiver does certainly have toslink optical and the AE is portable, so good for testing. Thanks, I may not have thought of that since the focus is on getting better audio upstairs.<br />

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I've found the file sharing off the Suse box to be very stable. Reconnects when rebooting are subjectively quicker now that when Windows 2K3 was in that role. And the install allowed the mirror to be set up thru the gui, which was nice, especially since this is not their commercial version.<br />

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As for the DAC, in this case budget means budget. Around $200.00 give or take. I am after a starting point. I am very keen on your review of the PS audio unit ( as an upgrade path) since I am aware of the many good reviews of their products over the years and my experience of a preamp I owned. (PS IV w/ the external power supply). That preamp had me relistening to my album collection.<br />

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One DAC that I've wanted to try out for some time is the Spitfire 24 Bit DAC from Firestone Audio. Through the AE 24/192 wouldn't matter, but the DAC appears to be of good quality.<br />

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http://www.audiophileproducts.com/spitfire<br />

Hi Chris<br />

Great site. My first post<br />

I have a question about your microsoft server system. I currently have the Crimson DAC and am using J River (which I'm not thrilled with) Operating software is Vista. If I understand correctly, there is no K mixer in Vista only XP. Will I benefit from the Airport express and using Itunes? How can one be certain that you are outputting "bitperfect"? I used to use EAC and all my music was ripped with uncompressed wavefiles. But J River can not pure wave files (at least I don't see how it does it) Even lossless compression seems to have audible consequences in my system. Any advice or comments are welcome. Thanks.

Hey celebrat - I haven't forgot about you. My wife and I moved across town over the past five days and it has been a little hectic around here to say the least. I'll dig in to this one shortly.

Hey celebrat - Am I reading this correctly that you're using a Wavelength Audio Crimson DAC? Wow, I've heard some incredible things about that DAC, but the Computer Audiophile coffer is certainly not full enough to afford it! You are correct about the absence of the KMixer in Vista. I still think you will benefit from sending audio out through the Ethernet/802.11 port because Vista is Vista and I haven't heard many stellar things about its audio capabilities. Don't get me wrong there are certainly good ways to get great sound from a Vista box. As far as bit perfect goes, this is often discussed in two different scenarios. 1. Is the bit for bit rip or copy of the actual music file. 2. Is the actual bit perfect playback of the music. There are a ton of programs out there that will address number 1 by comparing the files every which way but loose once you have ripped them. Using error correction while ripping has worked totally fine for me and I don't bother with comparing everything. In the audiophile world you have to pick what you really want to sink time and money into and think about return on time investment as well. For me, spending time and money on other things is better spent. <br />

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For bit perfect playback there are a couple ways to do it. If you have an HDCD recording ripped and you can play it back to a device that indicates HDCD playback this "should" tell you it is bit perfect. I can't guarantee this, but I have heard more than a few people in the industry suggest this method. <br />

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Another method is probably some very expensive equipment built for this purpose and a few others.<br />

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I'm sure there are several other ways to determine bit perfect output that I have let go in one ear and out the other. I usually let the engineers determine this one and go with their suggestions. <br />

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I too have all my music in uncompressed format, but I use AIFF. I don't want to have anything less than what came on the CD. Just my personal opinion and I have no desire to debate sonic differences of of compressed v. uncompressed music. We all like what we like and nobody else should really care :-)<br />

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Chris: am not familiar with the AE. How should it be used with PCs?<br />

1. Is it effective as a wireless device to stream a digital feed to a remotely located DAC? Can I get the optimal bit perfect results by connecting the AE to a DAC that is not located by my PC?<br />

2. Do you have to use the ethernet connection to hard wire the AE to your PC to get the benefits?<br />

3. If 2 is correct, does the AE work like a soundcard? I have a PC that does not pass 24/96 signals via the SPDIF output on the mobo. Will I be able to get 24/96 (or higher) with the AE connected to the same computer?

The AE is a pretty neat device, but usually considered mid-fi for very high jitter among other things.<br />

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You can certainly stream you iTunes library wirelessly to an AE that is connected directly to your DAC. This would allow you to leave your PC outside the listening room. Using the AE this way should give you bit perfect results because the audio is sent out over the wireless network and not through the internal sound card first. My understanding is that Apple has limited the AE to either 16/44.1 or 16/48. I can never remember. It is actually discussed on the site here quite a bit :-)<br />

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Does that clear it up? Let me know if it doesn't and I'll be happy to chat some more.

This topic has been picked up on the music server forum.

http://www.mini-box.com/Intel-D945GCLF-Mini-ITX-Motherboard<br />

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Intel D945GCLF motherboard running the new Atom 230 CPU. TDP of < 4W (that's the CPU next to the penny). Reports indicate that it runs Vista with ease (as long as you're running a decent amount of RAM). With a street price of < $90, it could be a great choice for a Windows-based music server. You'll probably want to put a better northbridge heatsink on it and pair it with a PICO PSU.

Those are pretty cool. I thought about putting together a music server with one of these, but I couldn't decide if I wanted to go the pico-its route instead.

Further to my posts earlier in this thread, I have been really enjoying my first computer system... so much in fact that I have hardly ripped any music (still plan to do see if I can hear a difference between AIFF and Apple Lossless) ! I have been exploring masses of different music via Internet radio, mostly at 192kbps. Two issues have prompted me to post now : firstly, I am getting a low level of interference through my speakers : not disturbing for most listening, but for late night choral, a real drag. I have 2 x 24" monitors side by side, a third monitor to one side, and two computers : is there anything I can do apart from running the (inevitably close together) cables as far apart as possible ?<br />

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Secondly, and related to this, I read recently on a Linn forum that plugging one's amp directly into a mains socket or cheap, standard mains extension block is far superior to any kind of special (and sometimes hugely expensive) mains cable / block. I have my primary computer equipment plugged into a Monster Cable power block with spike protection and mains conditioner and had originally plugged the amp into that : today I plugged it directly into a wall socket... Holy Moly.. a quantum leap forward in just about every area...<br />

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I still plan to add my REL subwoofer in July (it's in storage far away...).

Hey jtrade - It's great to hear you're really getting into your computer based system. <br />

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The low level interference can be many different things. There is actually some good information about solving this in the PS Audio DLIII manual. Not sure if the problem you describe is the same as they are talking about, but it's worth a shot. <a href="http://www.computeraudiophile.com/files/dl_iii_manual.pdf">Here is the manual</a>, scroll down to about page 10 (or the page numbered as 6 in by PSA).<br />

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I highly recommend plugging your amp directly into the power outlet. The only power product I would even think of using with an amp is a unit from <a href="http://www.runningspringsaudio.com/">Running Springs Audio</a>.

Interesting - with my recent amp purchase the salesperson cautioned me to plug directly into the wall as well. Said that you would really need to go to a substantial power conditioner to get a good result.<br />

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My spidey sense starts tingling whenever the word "substantial" is used in a high end shop. Didn't have to ask.... I just plugged the amp into the wall as recommended !

That's a great link, thanks, Chris : very clear and simple suggestions which I will go through step by step. Will let you know the outcome.<br />

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J.

Hello Chris,<br />

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I've been reading these music sever articles with increasing interest, but it seems that the better ones are getting more complex in terms of number of components (e.g., CA04) than the non-computer audio systems they are meant to be simplifying. I have long felt that the system with the most potential for a music server, both in terms of the user-interface and the likelihood of third-party vendors bringing their expertise to the party, is the one that many of us already have in our pocket -- the Ipod. I don't really listen to music on the go and suspect that if Apple put the Ipod in a mains-powered box with a display and an internal power amp that could sit on a shelf, then they would have an absolute winner. Make that internal amp a high-efficiency class-D digital amp (I'm thinking along the lines of the little amps from Trends Audio, but fed digitally), and there is potential for a serious audiophile system here, akin to the 'powerdac' feted in the audiophile world -- the perfect straight-line system of a DAC with gain. <br />

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Most people already have computers and can rip their audio there; the expensive and complex server implementations from Olive and the like (with CD writers, networking, Gracenote etc.) are duplicating a lot of (expensive) engineering that an 'Ipod in a box' could sweep away. Think about it: the NAND-based Ipods already have the jump on regular sever-based set-ups by using flash storage (= no need for backup, with many millions of read cycles before wear). 32GB isn't much storage at the moment, but Samsung is set to release 128GB NAND next year; stack these in an Ipod in a box (like the 2 x 16GB in the 32GB Ipod Touch model) and you start to have a realistic home music source, even for uncompressed audio. Hell, you could even just run a digital feed from the Ipod Touch to a digital amp (say, an Onkyo) and get approximately the same thing. Once it was made known that the 6th Gen 'classic' Ipods and the solid state models could output digital from the dock connector, this really got my interest. Imagine uncompressed WAV files digitally amplified from a small, cheap, jitter-free box -- the engineering, OS, interface, etc. is all there already -- and this would blow most audiophile systems out of the water for a fraction of the cost. Apple could put Texas Instruments PWM chip-amps into this and market it to the other few billion people in the world who don't listen to their music on the bus. Being Ipod, the third-party vendor's would soon jump on that bandwagon. <br />

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The way music servers at home are going is toward the (usually stupidly expensive) audiophile market; even the integrated 'music centre' type systems such as the Sonneteer Morpheus cost an arm and a leg -- I read (on the UHFMag website) that the price of the latter is going to be "...in the $5000 range". A lot of moolah, and an order of magnitude more expensive than a 32GB Ipod Touch, for little more than the ability to stream music around the house. The Ipod is wi-fi enabled already -- you can bet that the next model will have that connectivity bidirectional and be able to stream its own music. Forget about using your Ipod as a remote -- it could be your source!<br />

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Consider also that these Ipods push out 720 x 576 video from their dock connectiors: it's currently only MPEG4, so not DVD bit rates (VOB files, MPEG2) yet, but that's only a matter of time too. A robust music and video server for a few $100. I can't wait. Thoughts anyone...<br />

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cheers,<br />

Dave

Hey Dave - I like where you went with that detailed post. What you described has the potential to sound fabulous and expand the audience for great sound by many millions of listeners.<br />

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You should read the newest issue of Tone Audio Magazine. Jeff Dorgay reviewed the new Wadia 170 iTransport. Jeff has a very good reference system and he has nothing but praise for the iPod/Wadia combination. He is also certain that this will get many more young listeners into music and great sound. I think he is right on with that as well. My iTransport should be here as soon as they start shipping. Jeff bought them for all his reviewers!<br />

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One thing that needs improvement is the remote control aspect of using an iPod as a transport. Sure the new Wadia unit does come with a remote, but you're pretty much flying blind without a monitor/TV connected and some iPods won't output the menu to an external monitor, just video.<br />

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Have you looked into the Signal application? Not only does this work as a remote with an iPod Touch, it now allows you to stream your music to the iPod! I now have access to my 5 TB NAS device and complete iTunes library from my iPod Touch. While it does work, it is not very polished in terms of the interface etc... Hopefully at the Apple WWDC next week Apple will introduce some native iPod Touch applications and maybe the third party application iControl will come out soon.<br />

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Anyway, thanks for your thoughts on this whole thing!

Hello Chris,<br />

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The more I read on here about people's 24/96 audio wishes [of less interest to me, more anon] and the drive for audiophile music serving, the more I come back to the digital amplifier issue. Do you remember the TACT Millenium from a decade back -- the $10k amplifier that amplified digitally; SPDIF inputs, no -ve feedback, no clipping, volume adjusted by ps voltage regulation, effectively a DAC with gain and widely reviewed as the best sounding amp ever for digital signals? They now have a model (the M 2150) at $2200. Currently their amplifiers are only SPDIF, but USB is surely on the drawing-board. Such an amp connected to a laptop (or Ipod) would be the answer to most computer audiophile's dreams. Oh, and it's 24/96 out of the box. <br />

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Any chance of a review?<br />

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As for 24/96, while there seems to be lots of new music around, the big issue for me is the source. Lots of the Ampex masters from the 70s and 80s degraded during storage (the binding emulsion leached out), making them useless as archive. After baking in an oven (!), it was possible to play the tapes once to extract the signal, but they were useless therafter. Guess what so many of these master tapes were recorded to when this issue was discovered in the 1990s? 16/44 DAT. Pink Floyd, Roxy Music, many of the classic albums of 20 to 30 years ago are now fixed at this resolution (although the record companies don't trumpet this). Some of them (e.g., Avalon, by Roxy) were released as SACDs, even though the source is now only 16 bit. <br />

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So my excitement about 24/96 is limited. Still, the TACT amps look like a great opportunity for the server crowd. See if you can get one!<br />

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cheers,<br />

Dave